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http://indianaquariumhobbyist.com/community/ :: View topic - albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die
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albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die

 
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pravaka
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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 3:36 pm Post subject: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 hi,  my  albino  guppy  siting  to  bottem  of  th  tank  &  ater  few  day  die,  their   fins  &  tails  is  shrink  or  contract  i  am  not  able  to  id.  this  disease?  pls.  any  buddy  tell  me  which  diseases  is  this  &  how  to  treat  this
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krash
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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 6:54 pm Post subject: Re: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 Pravaka  
 
 sorry  to  hear  that,  can  u  post  a  few  close  up  pics  ,  thn  i  can  help  u  diagnose
 
 
 Sitting  at  the  bottom  -  this  symptom  can  mean  a  lot  of  things  basically  its  unwell,  but  if  a  few  more  symptoms  are  added  it  can  mean  something,  
 tail  &  fins  shrinking  i  guess  u  mean  are  being  shortened  or  eaten  away-  straight  off  it  looks  like  fin  rot  but  fin  rot  is  general  term  ,  we  need  to  see  what  bacteria  is  causing  it  then  i  can  recommend  a  treatment.  
 
 would  help  is  you  can  write  down  detail  symptoms  from  when  u  saw  it  being  unwell
 
 Cheers!
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Mohammed Mudassir
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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 7:23 pm Post subject: Re: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 can  you  give  us  the  tank  details,
 tank  size,  filtration,  feeding  ,tank  temperature,  water  change  regime  etc..
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pravaka
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PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 11:33 pm Post subject: Re: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 tank   size,   filtration,   feeding   ,tank   temperature,   water   change   regime   etc..
 my  tank  size  is  4'X1.5'X1.5',  i  use  2  sponge  filter  in  tank,  tank  temperature  is  around  26  to  28,  i  change  half  water  in  every  3/4  days
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krash
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 2:02 am Post subject: Re: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 Pravaka,
 
 these  specs  seem  ideal,   i  dont  see  a  problem  in  this.   
 
 Tank  is  adequate  ,  2  sponge  filters  shud  do.  water  change  is  gud.
 
 
 was  this  guppy  a  newly  bought  fish  or  did  u  have  it  for  some  time?  also  if  u  saw  any  symptoms  kindly  mention  that  too,  it  will  help  in  assessing  what  went  wrong  (mentioned  above)
 
 cheers
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krash
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 2:33 am Post subject: Re: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 another  thing  i  forgot  to  ask  is,  are  any  other  tank  mates  nipping  the  guppy  fins?
 
 also  the  fins  did  they  have  a  white  edge  to  it  or  reddish  veining  or  patch?
 
 Rgds
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psimhan
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 7:54 am Post subject: Re: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 Have  you  observed  the  guppy  "shimmying"  i.e.  trying  to  swim  fast  but  staying  in  one  place?
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pravaka
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 5:36 pm Post subject: Re: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 no,  any  othr  fish  not  snipping  to  my  guppy,  i  bought  this  fishes  newly  from  pune  i  bought  100  guppys,  3  or  4  guppys  doing  like  this,  one  gupp'sy  tail  is  cut  and  we  able  to  see  blood  on  the  tip  of  tail
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parthapratim22
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 5:50 pm Post subject: Re: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 100  Surprised  
 
 in  one  tank???
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uzair
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PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 2:26 am Post subject: Re: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 100  fishes  in  a  4  feeter  is  fine,  and  out  of  100  fishes  a  few  dies  it  is  normal...  probably  a  few  more  would  die,  but  as  they  start  breeding  the  frys  as  they  grow  would  be  very  stable  and  healthy...
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krash
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PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 4:08 am Post subject: Re: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 Pravaka,  Hi!
 
 OK,  you  have  mentioned  that  your  guppies  are  fairly  new,  also  that  they  are  not  Shimming  as  mentioned  by  Pradeep.  Also  that  their  tail  is  frayed  (u  said  cut  i  m  assuming  u  meant  -  looks  torn  &  shredded  look),  with  bloody  tip.
 
 U  have  also  mentioned  you  have  a  100  guppies  -  thats  a  lot  even  though  as  per  your  specs  your  tank  works  up  to  254ltr  tank.  I  would  recommend  4-5  nos  per  50  ltrs,  so  u  could  keep  abt  50  -60.  
 
 But  if  u  r  changing  abt  50%  water  twice  a  week  like  u  mentioned,  i  think  u  can  manage  with  these  nos.  (recommended  not  to)
 
 Now  assessing  from  what  u  have  told,  i  think  your  guppies  have  a  gram  negative  bacterial  infection  ,  most  likely  "Pseudomonas  septicemia"  leading  to  fin  rot  .  
 
 Now  to  tell  u  why  i  feel  your  fish  has  this  disease  i  will  explain  a  bit  more  for  your  knowledge  &  so  that  in  future  u  can  diagnose  better.
 
 firstly  the  information  is  limited,  fish  display  similar  symptoms  when  sick  or  are  infected.  For  example-  not  eating  food,  staying  aloof,  fin  damage,  color  change,  change  in  their  feces,etc.  In  india  few  places  have  proper  veterinary  facility  to  examine  fishes  &  treat  them.  so  no  X-ray,  blood  sample,  tissue  analysis,etc.
 
 So  when  we  are  relying  only  on  external  symptoms,  it  is  important  to  have  sequence  of  events  or  clear  combination  of  symptoms.  Also  different  bacteria  effect  different  fishes  differently.
 
 eg-  if  fish  has  blood  shot  eyes,  bleeding  veins,  ulcers,  blood  hemorrhages  at  base  of  its  fins  it  will  mostly  be  a  Aeromonas  Hydrophila  bacterial  infection.  If  the  same  symptoms  are  present  with  fin  or  tail  damage  it  will  be  Pseudomonas  Bacteria   strain.  so  a  subtle  change  can  tell  u  more,  this  is  important  cause  then  we  can  use  the  correct  antibiotic,  effective  towards  that  bacteria,  rather  than  using  a  broad  spectrum  antibiotics  &  save  more  fishes.
 
 Now  as  you  have  mentioned  severe  fin  shortening  with  bloody  stains  on  fins  I  believe  your  guppies  are  dieing  of  
 pseudomonas  infection.   Cause  of  the  disease  is  mainly  poor  water  quality  that  enables  this  bacteria  to  bloom  &  which  results  in  fish  immunity  dropping  &  these  bacteria  are  opportunistic  &  will  start  infecting  the  fish.
 
 I  think  since  u  said  u  maintain  your  water  well  with  water  changes  (incl.  siphoning  all  the  dirt  from  the  bottom)  every  2  to  3  days,  most  probably  the  LFS  from  where  u  bought  the  guppies  would  have  kept  them  in  poor  conditions  &  would  have  carried  the  infection  to  your  tank.
 
 The  best  course  of  action  is  a  antibiotic  bath  treatment.  u  can  also  prepare  a  medicated  food  &  feed  them,  but  for  guppies  i  think  the  bath  treatment  is  easier  &  works  well.  I  will  give  u  three  options  in  receding  order  of  preference:
 
 1>  u  can  buy  off  the  counter  medication  from  LFS,  most  are  imported  &  all  costly  with  a  price  range  of  10$  to  30$.  They  come  with  instructions  of  use.  The  best  in  that  for  this  disease  is  Seachem's  -kanaplex  ;  followed  by  API's  -FURAN-2  (not  Furan-1)or  API's  -Triple  sulpha  or  Mardel-  Maracyn  Plus  .  U  can  use  which  ever  u  get.  
 if  u  dont  prefer  allopathic  medicine,  u  can  use  herbal  remedies,  most  effective  in  this  case  will  be  API's-  Melafix.
 
 2>  You  can  use  a  antibiotic  available  in  India  in  medical  stores  that  keep  veterinary  medications  called   ENROCIN  15  ml  Injection  vial  bottle.   (Rs.49/bottle).  This  is  the  most  effective  against  this  bacteria.  i  would  recommend  this.
 
 Dosage  &  usage:-  
 u  will  need  to  use  500mg  to  600mg  for  your  tank  size.  So  abt  5ml  to  6ml  per  dose.  Change  the  water  60%  after  6  hours  of  adding  the  antibiotic.(recommended  not  to  exceed  beyond  10hr  exposure).  Repeat  the  dosage  every  24  hrs  (ie:  every  day)  &  follow  the  process  for  5  days,  so  5  doses  will  have  to  be  done.  If  required  up  to  8  days  ,  so  8  doses  of  the  same.  
 
 
 3>  if  you  cant  find  Enrocin  or  its  difficult,  then  you  can  use  this  medicine  -  BACTRIM  DS,  available  at  all  medical  stores,  since  its  still  used  in  human  medication.  Though  less  effective  than  the  above  one,  but  works  pretty  well.  also  is  cheaper.
 
 Dosage  &  usage:
 
 Bactrim  DS  is  available  as  a  tablet  of  10  tabs  per  strip.  each  tab  is  800mg.  u  will  have  to  buy  3  strips,  each  costing  abt  12RS.  U  will  have  to  use  3  tabs  per  dose.  powder  3  tabs  properly  as  fine  as  possible  then  mix  well  in  a  mug  of  warm  water  &  pour  into  the  tank.  mix  it  well  into  the  tank  my  stirring  it  in  the  tank  .  after  24  hrs  change  50%  water  &  repeat  the  dosage.  U  will  have  to  do  this  for  10  days,  so  10  doses.
 
 
 Other  points  to  remember  -  pl.  raise  temperature  to  28C  or  29C.  (when  running  antibiotics  u  need  to  raise  the  temp.  to  increase  efficacy  of  the  drug,  &  help  the  fish  to  metabolize  the  drug  better).  Increase  the  aeration  in  the  tank  by  increasing  the  bubble  flow  of  your  sponge  filters,  this  is  important  since  in  warmer  water  solubility  of  oxygen  is  poor.  Also  u  can  buy  a  bottle  of  acriflavine  &  add  it  to  the  tank  it  will  help  in  disinfecting  the  damaged  fins.  
 Most  General  aid  medications  available  at  aquarium  shops  is  acriflavine.  Just  ask  for  general  aid  medication  at  your  LFS  &  a  thumb  rule  to  check  if  its  that;  is  that  acriflavine  will  be  a  yellowish  in  color  or  greenish  yellow  in  color.  Add  this  after  every  water  change  everyday  with  the  medication  as  per  instructions  on  the  bottle.
 
 Remember  to  follow  the  dosage  &  process  for  the  full  course  for  effectiveness.
 
 Guppies  that  are  in  the  secondary  stage  of  the  disease  might  not  respond  to  the  medication  since  the  infection  would  hav  become  systemic  &  fatal.  But  it  will  save  the  others  &  prevent  the  infection  from  spreading  to  others  &  becoming  virulent,  &  heal  the  ones  in  primary  stage  of  symptoms.  Also  if  u  dont  want  to  run  the  medication  in  the  main  tank  &  have  a  smaller  treatment  tank,  u  can  net  the  sick  guppies  &  do  the  same  treatment.  calculate  the  volume  &  follow  the  same  dilutions.  
 Recommended  in  the  main  tank  since  guppies  being  small  u  cant  notice  the  primary  symptoms,  also  if  abt  8  to  10  guppies  u  feel  are  infected  then  the  bacteria  has  become  virulent  &  will  be  in  high  nos  &  the  risk  of  them  spreading  to  other  fishes  is  high.
 
 also  if  u  notice  any  other  symptoms  like  whitish  patch  around  the  mouth  or  on  the  dorsal  fin,  if  the  damaged  fin  has  a  whitish  edge  to  it  or  the  gills  of  the  fish  are  opened  up,  spots  on  the  skin,etc.  do  post  or  pm,  since  it  means  the  infection  is  different  or  more  severe  &  i  can  recommend  additional  steps  to  take.
 
 In  my  experience  this  was  effective  for  this  infection  &  worked  for  my  friends  too.  So  hope  this  helps  u,  any  doubts  do  reply.  
 
 Remember  the  best  way  is  to  prevent  rather  than  treat.
 So  keep  your  water  quality  good,  frequent  water  changes,  keep  the  source  of  your  water  good.  Many  people  who  use  bore-well  water  or  from  a  well  will  see  a  rise  in  infections  especially  after  the  rains.
 
 TC
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parthapratim22
Regular Poster on IAH
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Joined: Apr 02, 2011
Posts: 1116
Location: KOLKATA>HYDERABAD>DELHI

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PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2011 2:55 pm Post subject: Re: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 very  good  Man...fab  treatment...this  will  help  the  guppies
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abhis9
Committed Member of IAH
Committed Member of IAH



Joined: Nov 17, 2008
Posts: 3236
Location: Kolkata, West Bengal, India

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PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2011 3:50 pm Post subject: Re: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 Nicely  described  .....Excellent  write  up  dude........
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krash
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Frequent Visitor to IAH



Joined: May 25, 2011
Posts: 147


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PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2011 5:04 pm Post subject: Re: albino guppy siting to bottem of th tank & die Reply with quote

 Hi  Pravaka,
 
 Got  your  PM   Thanks  for  the  feedback,  hope  it  works,  do  reply  on  their  developments.
 
 Also  for  your  ease  in  identifying  &  buying  the  medicines,  I  am  attaching  their  pics.  Wanna  see  them  survive  &  you  succeeding.
 
 Thank  you  Abis9  &  parthapratim22,  hope  to  write  more  information  when  other  queries  come,  its  a  sad  need  in  India  &  many  loose  a  lot  to  diseases;  &  most  of  the  off  -shelf  meds  are  imported  &  expensive  &  out  of  reach  for  many.
 
 Cheers!
 
 http://www.indiamart.com/aryan-generic/products.html
 
 http://www.4nrx.co.uk/infection/bactrim-ds-trimethoprim-sulfamethoxazole.html
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