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http://indianaquariumhobbyist.com/community/ :: View topic - Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace.
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Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace.
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cokeamod
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 3:17 pm Post subject: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 Hi  all,
 Green  water  problem!
 So  I  thought  why  not  start  a  thread  on  this  particular  nuisance.
 
 Current  scene:  250L,  70-80%  covered  with  stems,  including  fast  growing  hygrophila  sp.,  rotalas,  cabomba,  ammania,  bacopa,  and  rest  with  glosso  and  hair  grass.
 Co2  1  bubble  per  2-3sec,  lighting  3.5  Watts\Gallon,  water  change  30-50%  every  3  days.
 
 Dosing:  KNO3  and  Flourish  started  at  day  15  with  low  levels,  immediately  started  to  get  green  water  bloom,  no  P  yet  as  have  fish  in  the  tank  and  feed  them.
 But  then,  what  is  the  One  stop  solution  to  green  water??
 
 I  read  a  lot  and  people  suggest:
 1)  Blackout  for  4-5  days,  personally  did  not  like  this  as  plants  might  get  thin,  glosso  might  jump  up.
 2)  Increase  N  and  K,  traces,  and  make  P  the  limiting  factor.
 3)  Install  a  diatom  filter.  (but  isn't  that  like  a  temporary  cure?)
 4)  Pour  algae  destroying  chemicals  in  the  tank!  :O
 5)  Green  water  will  go  on  its  own?!
 
 I  am  definitely  not  doing  anything  until  our  experts  suggest  something,  can  people  contribute  their  experiences  with  this  menace,  and  remedies  they've  tried?
 
 regards,
 amod.
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Rana
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 3:23 pm Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 Amod
 
 I  would  suggest,  "Do  Nothing"  other  than  your  usual  maintenance.  Continue  regular  fertilisation  and  water  change  with  lights  on.
 
 Green  water  will  go  away  automatically  after  few  days  (10  to  15  days).  One  fine  morning  you  will  find  the  water  is  crystal  clear.
 
 I  am  writing  this  from  my  own  experience  of  having  three  planted  aquarium.
 
 regards
 Rana
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mayurdev
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 3:29 pm Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 Hi  Amod
 Is  your  tank  exposed  to  sunlight  by  any  chance?
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cokeamod
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 3:38 pm Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 No  sunlight.  Not  even  indirect.
 
 Is  there  any  relation  of  green  water  with  P?  That  is,  will  increasing  N  and  K  help  in  any  way??
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Rana
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 3:44 pm Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 Amod
 
 Green  water  is  believed  to  be  more  related  with  Ammonia.  When  the  your  filter  is  not  matured  enough,  it  will  not  be  able  to  convert  ammonia  to  nitrite/nitrate  and  hence  encourages  green  water.
 
 After  few  days,  when  the  filter  or  substrate  is  occupied  with  enough  nitrifying  bacteria,  the  ammonia  level  will  reduce  and  so  the  green  water.
 
 regards
 Rana
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Sibesh
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 3:55 pm Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 Amod,
 I  had  similar  green  water  problem  in  my  2x1.5x1.5  planted  tank.  I  also  went  through  various  forums  with  various  suggestions.  I  just  cut  my  light  from  64  watt  to  28  watt  and  it  did  the  trick  !  The  green  water  was  gone  in  2-3  days.
 
 Give  it  a  try  if  you  feel  like.
 
 HIH,
 Sibesh
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rohansd
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 3:55 pm Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 Cant  agree  more  with  Rana.
 Just  that,  I  do  more  water  changes  when  I  have  green  water.
 With  more  I  mean,  more   number  of  water  changes  (  say  twice  a  week)  and  large  quantity  of  water  at  a  time(  little  more  than  50%).
 Please  dont  stop  your  dosing,lights  and  co2.
 
 My  tank  has  got  green  water  lot  of  times  in  its  initial  stages:)  
 
 what  is  the  photo  period  of  your  tank  ?
 I  noticed  that  after  doing  a  80%  percent  water  change,  the  water  used  to  be  clear  and  it  would  start  turning  cloudy  and  eventually  green  after  5  or  6  PM.
 So,I  reduced  my  photo  period  to  8  hrs  for  first  1.5  month  and  gradually  increased  it  to  12  hrs  and  it  worked  well  for  me.
 
 I  have  tried  black  out  too  and  it  has  always  worked  perfectly  by  the  end  of  4th  day  but  the  plants  suffer  a  lot.
 
 As  rana  said,  do  nothing  and  continue  with  your  current  regime.
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vkv
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 7:42 pm Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 Just  follow  your  usual  regimen.  It  will  go  away  soon...
 
 If  not  then,  you  can  try  to  figure  out  teh  problem...
 
 Regards,
 Venkat
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nytyn
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 8:18 pm Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 But  then,  what  is  the  One  stop  solution  to  green  water??  
 
 If  you  are  really  looking  for  a  one  stop  solution,  go  in  for  a  UV  sterilizer.  Tried  it,  and  it  works  like  a  charm.  Max  24  to  36  hours,  and  you  will  have  crystal  clear  water.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 10:32 pm Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 what  Nitin  told  is  correct,  it  is  the  best  way  to  control  algae  but  sometimes  it  might  kill  beneficial  bacteria.
 What  is  the  ph?  Is  is  corporation  water?  What  is  the  filtration  you  have  used?  
 1.create  more  current.
 2.see  if  potassium  is  more  
 3.Do  you  have  any  algae  eaters  in  your  tank
 4.Use  charcoal
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ravi
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 10:28 am Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

                                                   
Rana  wrote  (View  Post):                
Green  water  is  believed  to  be  more  related  with  Ammonia.                

 
 NH4+  (Ammonia)  =  GW.  As  simple  as  that.  When  you  have  excess  Ammonia,  you  will  get  GW.  
                                                   
Quote:                
Oops  !  Ammonia  should  read  Ammonium  !  -  edited  24/07/2008                

 What  do  you  need  to  get  rid  of  GW  ?
 

     
  •  Keep  lights  on  for  full  photo  period.  (About  10  to  12  hours,  whatever  you  had  earlier,  keep  same  photo  period.)
     
  •  Stop  Ammonia  inducing  materials  nutrient,  like  Jobe  sticks.
     
  •  Dose  other  nutrients  in  moderation;  maybe  1/2  to  2/3  regular  dose.
     
  •  Make  sure  Co2  is  30  ppm
     

 
 What  not  to  do  ?
 

     
  •  Lights  off  for  few  days  -  This  will  not  work;  you  have  excess  nutrients  which  needs  to  be  removed;  no  lights  =  no  Photosynthesis  =  ammonia  remains
     
  •  Cover  tank  with  blanket  -  See  above
     
  •  Ultra  violet  radiation  -  Algae  spores  are  everywhere.  As  long  as  the  condition  for  growth  is  right,  they  will  grow  explosively.  
     
  •  Algacides  -  Again,  you  are  treating  the  symptom.  Try  and  tackle  the  root  cause,  which  is  nutrient  imbalance.
     
  •  Stop  dosing  -  Once  ammonia  &  other  nutrient  are  used  up,  you  are  going  to  have  other  algae  take  over  your  tank.  
     

 
 Most  algae  infestations  are  Co2  &  other  nutrient  deficiency.  In  all  cases,  part  of  the  cure  is  to  make  sure  Co2  is  maintained  at  30  ppm.  Then,  check  other  nutrients.


Last edited by ravi on Thu Jul 24, 2008 3:38 pm; edited 1 time in total
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ravi
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 10:36 am Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 Hi  Manju,
 
                                                 
manju  wrote  (View  Post):                
what  Nitin  told  is  correct,  it  is  the  best  way  to  control  algae  but  sometimes  it  might  kill  beneficial  bacteria.
 What  is  the  ph?  Is  is  corporation  water?  What  is  the  filtration  you  have  used?  
 1.create  more  current.
 2.see  if  potassium  is  more  
 3.Do  you  have  any  algae  eaters  in  your  tank
 4.Use  charcoal                

 
 Sorry,  points  1,  2  &  3  will  not  help  cure  GW.  Point  4  will  remove  remove  all  nutrients  till  charcoal  is  saturated.  After  that,  it's  useless.
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ravi
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 10:59 am Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 Hi  Amod,
 
 
                                                 
cokeamod  wrote  (View  Post):                
2)  Increase  N  and  K,  traces,  and  make  P  the  limiting  factor.                

 
 Your  plants  will  not  like  your  "Nutrient  X  as  limiting  factor"  theory.  If  you  limit  any  particular  nutrient,  you  will  have  more  algae  problems.  The  old  theory  was,  excess  Phosphates  were  responsible  for  most  algae  growth.  The  newer  theory  is,  nutrient  deficiencies  are  responsible.  Please  note  that  both  these  theories  might  be  2  sides  of  the  same  coin.  Excess  &  deficient  are  all  relative  too.
 
 I  suggest  you  read  up  on  Tom  Barr's  Estimative  Index.  Tom  strongly  advocates  against  "Limiting  Factors".  Reason  being,  you  will  hurt  the  plants  lot  more  than  hurting  algae.  Also,  many  nutrients  influences  the  uptake  of  other  nutrients.  For  example,  excess  iron  can  block  the  uptake  of  manganese.  If,  by  limiting  factor,  iron  becomes  excess  in  relation  to  other  nutrients  which  may  be  used  as  limiting  factor,  your  plants  will  exhibit  manganese  deficiency.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 12:44 pm Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 Kudos  to  some  superb  explanations  by  Ravi.  Clapping   Thumb Up
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cokeamod
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 1:15 am Post subject: Re: Green water! Shared experiences in tackling this menace. Reply with quote

 @rohan
 Doing  water  change  on  every  3  day!  50%!  Photo  period  is  7  hours,  because  the  lighting  is  MH  and  the  tank  is  yet  to  complete  1  month.
 Also,  even  i  can  see  less  GW  in  the  early  hours  and  increases  significantly  in  the  evenings,  that  obviously  means  they  are  increasing  under  the  light.
 
 @venkatji
 Yes,  even  i  am  trying  to  follow  the  usual  dosing  regime,  lets  hope  it  clears  up  in  a  week  or  two.
 
 @manju
 Corporation  water,  ph  out  of  the  tap  7.0  to  7.3,  after  co2  6.8  to  7.0  How  will  algae  eaters  'eat'  green  water?  Charcoal???
 
 
                                                 
Quote:                
NH4+  (Ammonia)  =  GW.  As  simple  as  that.  When  you  have  excess  Ammonia,  you  will  get  GW.                  

 50%  water  changes  every  3rd  day  with  aged  water.  5  rummy  nose  tetras  in  a  250L  tank.  How  much  NH3  could  they  be  producing  with  one  single  feeding  everyday?  Or  do  you  mean  ammonia  by  dead  plant  leaves  or  by  the  sand??   Huh  
 
 
                                                 
Quote:                
I  suggest  you  read  up  on  Tom  Barr's  Estimative  Index.  Tom  strongly  advocates  against  "Limiting  Factors".  Reason  being,  you  will  hurt  the  plants  lot  more  than  hurting  algae.  Also,  many  nutrients  influences  the  uptake  of  other  nutrients.  For  example,  excess  iron  can  block  the  uptake  of  manganese.  If,  by  limiting  factor,  iron  becomes  excess  in  relation  to  other  nutrients  which  may  be  used  as  limiting  factor,  your  plants  will  exhibit  manganese  deficiency.                

 
 Good  point,  yes  I  read  up  on  the  barr  report,  my  new  question  is,  see  i  am  dosing  N  and  K  at  little  less  than  required,  also  dosing  flourish  at  60%  its  dosage,  doing  water  changes  every  3rd  day,  light  150W  MH  for  7  hours,  also  adding  3  drops  GD  directly  to  the  tank  after  lights  out...
 
 Do  i  still  need  to  add  P,  or  will  the  plants  get  enough  from  the  fish\fish  foods\flourish?  And  do  the  experts  still  think  i  should  just  continue  with  this  regime?
 
 By  the  way  everybody,  plant  growth  is  not  hampered  at  all!  They  are  growing  good,  tall,  bushy  and  bright!  Even  the  moderately  difficult  Rotala  wallichii  has  grown  around  5-6  inches  in  8-10  days.
 regards,
 amod.
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