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http://indianaquariumhobbyist.com/community/ :: View topic - what is wrong? - firemouth cichlid
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what is wrong? - firemouth cichlid

 
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sssram
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 6:26 pm Post subject: what is wrong? - firemouth cichlid Reply with quote

 Hello  all,
 
 One  of  my  Firemouth  Cichlid  is  suddenly  has  white  salt  like  growth  at  the  line  of  top  fin  joining  the  body.
 It  is  there  since  last  four  days.  But  the  fish  is  still  active  and  eating  well.
 How  severe  is  the  disease  ?  I  doubt  it  may  not  be  ICK.  Should  I  quarantine  and  what  is  the  treatment.
 kindly  suggest  and  help?
 http://i.imgur.com/Nmhwz.jpg
 http://i.imgur.com/Ih7SC.jpg
 
 sssram
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rocky2
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 7:18 pm Post subject: Re: what is wrong? - firemouth cichlid Reply with quote

 it  seeems  som  kind  of  fungal  infection  so  quarintine  the  fish  and  raise  temp  add  some  salt  and  check  and  do  aprtial  water  changes....
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 4:01 pm Post subject: Re: what is wrong? - firemouth cichlid Reply with quote

 Hi  Sram,
 
 Looking  at  your  Snaps  &  what  you  have  mentioned  I  believe  that  your  Firemouth  cichlid  has  "Lymphocystis".
 
 Now  to  explain  it  better  for  you,  I  have  taken  it  point  wise  for  you  in  detail.
 
 Firstly  lets  start  with  Symptoms-
 
 A)  Symptoms:-
 
 >>  In  mild  cases  of  this  infection,  wart  like  growth  on  the  skin  &  fins  of  the  fish,  surface  of  the  warts  look  crusted            almost  cauliflower  like  or  dried  salted  look.  
 
 >>  In  stronger  infection  cases  lesions  with  growth  masses  form,  which  can  grow  to  a  lump.  
 
 >>  Mostly  external  but  can  go  internal  infect  the  spleen,  or  even  inside  the  eye.
 
 
 Cause  :-
 
 Cause  of  the  infection  &  caused  by  what
 
 >>  Its  a  Viral  infection  caused  by  the  lymphocysti  virus.   Its  an  Iridovirus,  hence  the  multicolor  effect  on  some  lesions  or  growths  of  this  infection.
 >>  It  is  mainly  caused  by  poor  water  conditions  for  a  prolonged  time,  which  in  turn  reduces  the  immunity  of  the  fish  &  the  virus  goes  out  of  control.  Also  happens  in  over  crowded  &  highly  bullied  fish.  
 >>  Virus  is  common  in  fish  population  &  most  fishes  with  healthy  immunity  keep  it  at  bay.
 >>  Also  this  not  a  fatal  disease,  but  having  said  that  it  can  grossly  dis-figure  the  fish.  If  it  effects  parts  like  the  gills,  mouth,  anus,etc  can  cause  death.  If  it  effects  internal  organs  can  kill  too.  But  most  fishes  with  improved  immunity  will  recover  well.  
 >>  Have  to  keep  an  eye  for  secondary  bacterial  infection
 
 [b]Treatment:-[/b]
 
 >>  Shift  the  effected  fish  to  bare  bottom  quarantine  tank.
 >>  Use  pristine  water  for  the  fish,  if  affordable  &  available  use  filtered  water.  
 >>  Add  Methylene  blue  in  the  Tank  as  per  dilutions  mentioned  on  the  bottle.  It  helps  in  oxygen  transfer  in  gill  filaments,  soothes  the  lesions  &  has  mild  antiseptic  properties.
 >>  Don't  add  salt  as  it  will  irritate  the  lesions  more.
 >>  Run  a  antibiotic  course  to  prevent  secondary  bacterial  infections.
 >>  Do  WC  daily  or  alternate  days,  about  30  to  50  %,  making  sure  to  remove  the  dirt  at  the  bottom  of  the  tank.
 >>  Can  add  fish  skin  &  slime  coat  conditioner  in  the  water,  it  helps  in  recovery.
 
 Like  i  said  above  poor  water  condition  is  the  trigger  for  the  infection.  You  have  not  told  your  WC  routine,  tank  dimensions  &  filter.  All  these  effect  your  water  parameters.
 Now  coming  to  your  tank,  your  water  looks  ok  in  the  PICs,  but  with  sand  as  a  substrate  it  is  possible  that  when  you  do  WC,  enough  of  the  waste  is  not  being  removed,  whereby  your  water  parameters  may  be  poor.  
 Also  your  WC  change  procedure  &  frequency  may  be  low.  Also  i  see  only  a  Power  filter  in  the  pic,  though  it  has  its  uses,  it  is  not  very  good  as  bio-chemical  filter.  
 
 Also  in  the  pic  your  firemouth  has  pink  pimple  like  nodule  forming  on  his  gill  plate,  could  be  bacterial  or  just  lesion  forming  from  the  viral  infections.  So  will  advice  a  antibiotic  course.
 Kindly  look  if  he  is  developing  any  red  vein  like  appearance  on  his  fins,  or  redness  on  the  base  of  his  Fins  or  around  his  eye  or  the  stomach  area.  Look  closely  if  possible  shine  a  torch  &  look,  because  the  redness  in  between  the  scales  will  not  be  visible  easily.  Based  on  this  you  can  decide  which  antibiotic  to  run,  if  not  we  can  run  a  milder  broad  spectrum  antibiotic.
 
 Antibiotic  treatment  method:-
 https://skydrive.live.com/view.aspx?cid=60FBE185CBAA136D&resid=60FBE185CBAA136D%21127#
 
 Below  is  link  to  a  write-up  on  this,  do  read  thru  will  hep  increase  the  knowledge  on  this  issue  better.
 
 http://library.enaca.org/Health/DiseaseLibrary/LymphocystisDis.pdf
 
 http://www.vet.uga.edu/VPP/clerk/Kurkjian/index.php
 
 
 Also  put  a  few  links  on  the  pic  of  this  disease  for  your  info:-
 
 http://www.bonniesplants.com/lymphocystis.shtml
 
 http://www.h2oacquariofilia.it/malattiedettaglio.asp?ID=47
 
 http://badmanstropicalfish.com/fish_palace/lymphocystis_tomchoi.html
 
 
 TC  &  regards
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sssram
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 4:10 pm Post subject: Re: what is wrong? - firemouth cichlid Reply with quote

 Dear  Krash
 
 Thank  you  for  such  a  detailed  information.  i  will  go  through  the  full  info  and  give  feed  back.
 
 sssram
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2011 10:04 pm Post subject: Re: what is wrong? - firemouth cichlid Reply with quote

 Dear  Krash  
 
 It  is  sure  "Lymphocystis".  
 This  fish  was  introduced  along  with  other  cichlids  in  a  newl  set  up  tank  about  6  weeks  ago.
 The  tank  was  an  old  cycled  except  for  the  sand  which  was  added  after  washing  it  several  times.
 All  fishes  are  in  good  shape  except  this  one  which  developed  this  viral  infection.  After  the  first  white  growth  within  three  days  it  spread  to  the  full  length  of  top  fin,  though  the  fish  was  active.
 
 As  soon  as  I  saw  your  post  I  immediately  isolated  this  one  and  I  think  the  fish  has  developed  more  infection  with  reddish  fins  and  gills.
 
 This  was  quarantined  with  fresh  clean  water  with  methylene  blue  and  daily  50%  water  change.  For  three  days  it  was  sick  and  I  thought  it  will  die.  But  now  I  think  it  has  recovered  and  there  is  no  infection.  The  white  growth  had  turned  in  to  pale  yellow  and  has  shrunk  to  some  extent.  The  hole  like  spot  on  the  right  gill  also  has  improved.
 But  it  not  yet  recoverted  fully  and  is  not  active.  It  takes  food  sparingly.  I  have  introduced  few  baby  sword  tails  to  give  it  comfort  and  company.
 
 Hope  it  will  improve  further.  But  how  long  it  will  take  and  can  it  be  again  put  in  to  main  tank  with  other  cichlid  ?
 As  I  understand  it  has  to  live  with  its  ugly  fin.  
 
 Thank  you  once  again  for  your  information  and  suggession.
 
 [img]http://imgur.com/oEpEh[/img]
 [img]http://imgur.com/iZgUj[/img]
 [img]http://imgur.com/qJb2S[/img]
 
 sssram
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2011 12:38 am Post subject: Re: what is wrong? - firemouth cichlid Reply with quote

                                                   
krash  wrote  (View  Post):                
Hi  Sram,
 
 Looking  at  your  Snaps  &  what  you  have  mentioned  I  believe  that  your  Firemouth  cichlid  has  "Lymphocystis".
 
 Now  to  explain  it  better  for  you,  I  have  taken  it  point  wise  for  you  in  detail.
 
 Firstly  lets  start  with  Symptoms-
 
 A)  Symptoms:-
 
 >>  In  mild  cases  of  this  infection,  wart  like  growth  on  the  skin  &  fins  of  the  fish,  surface  of  the  warts  look  crusted            almost  cauliflower  like  or  dried  salted  look.  
 
 >>  In  stronger  infection  cases  lesions  with  growth  masses  form,  which  can  grow  to  a  lump.  
 
 >>  Mostly  external  but  can  go  internal  infect  the  spleen,  or  even  inside  the  eye.
 
 
 Cause  :-
 
 Cause  of  the  infection  &  caused  by  what
 
 >>  Its  a  Viral  infection  caused  by  the  lymphocysti  virus.   Its  an  Iridovirus,  hence  the  multicolor  effect  on  some  lesions  or  growths  of  this  infection.
 >>  It  is  mainly  caused  by  poor  water  conditions  for  a  prolonged  time,  which  in  turn  reduces  the  immunity  of  the  fish  &  the  virus  goes  out  of  control.  Also  happens  in  over  crowded  &  highly  bullied  fish.  
 >>  Virus  is  common  in  fish  population  &  most  fishes  with  healthy  immunity  keep  it  at  bay.
 >>  Also  this  not  a  fatal  disease,  but  having  said  that  it  can  grossly  dis-figure  the  fish.  If  it  effects  parts  like  the  gills,  mouth,  anus,etc  can  cause  death.  If  it  effects  internal  organs  can  kill  too.  But  most  fishes  with  improved  immunity  will  recover  well.  
 >>  Have  to  keep  an  eye  for  secondary  bacterial  infection
 
 [b]Treatment:-[/b]
 
 >>  Shift  the  effected  fish  to  bare  bottom  quarantine  tank.
 >>  Use  pristine  water  for  the  fish,  if  affordable  &  available  use  filtered  water.  
 >>  Add  Methylene  blue  in  the  Tank  as  per  dilutions  mentioned  on  the  bottle.  It  helps  in  oxygen  transfer  in  gill  filaments,  soothes  the  lesions  &  has  mild  antiseptic  properties.
 >>  Don't  add  salt  as  it  will  irritate  the  lesions  more.
 >>  Run  a  antibiotic  course  to  prevent  secondary  bacterial  infections.
 >>  Do  WC  daily  or  alternate  days,  about  30  to  50  %,  making  sure  to  remove  the  dirt  at  the  bottom  of  the  tank.
 >>  Can  add  fish  skin  &  slime  coat  conditioner  in  the  water,  it  helps  in  recovery.
 
 Like  i  said  above  poor  water  condition  is  the  trigger  for  the  infection.  You  have  not  told  your  WC  routine,  tank  dimensions  &  filter.  All  these  effect  your  water  parameters.
 Now  coming  to  your  tank,  your  water  looks  ok  in  the  PICs,  but  with  sand  as  a  substrate  it  is  possible  that  when  you  do  WC,  enough  of  the  waste  is  not  being  removed,  whereby  your  water  parameters  may  be  poor.  
 Also  your  WC  change  procedure  &  frequency  may  be  low.  Also  i  see  only  a  Power  filter  in  the  pic,  though  it  has  its  uses,  it  is  not  very  good  as  bio-chemical  filter.  
 
 Also  in  the  pic  your  firemouth  has  pink  pimple  like  nodule  forming  on  his  gill  plate,  could  be  bacterial  or  just  lesion  forming  from  the  viral  infections.  So  will  advice  a  antibiotic  course.
 Kindly  look  if  he  is  developing  any  red  vein  like  appearance  on  his  fins,  or  redness  on  the  base  of  his  Fins  or  around  his  eye  or  the  stomach  area.  Look  closely  if  possible  shine  a  torch  &  look,  because  the  redness  in  between  the  scales  will  not  be  visible  easily.  Based  on  this  you  can  decide  which  antibiotic  to  run,  if  not  we  can  run  a  milder  broad  spectrum  antibiotic.
 
 Antibiotic  treatment  method:-
 https://skydrive.live.com/view.aspx?cid=60FBE185CBAA136D&resid=60FBE185CBAA136D%21127#
 
 Below  is  link  to  a  write-up  on  this,  do  read  thru  will  hep  increase  the  knowledge  on  this  issue  better.
 
 http://library.enaca.org/Health/DiseaseLibrary/LymphocystisDis.pdf
 
 http://www.vet.uga.edu/VPP/clerk/Kurkjian/index.php
 
 
 Also  put  a  few  links  on  the  pic  of  this  disease  for  your  info:-
 
 http://www.bonniesplants.com/lymphocystis.shtml
 
 http://www.h2oacquariofilia.it/malattiedettaglio.asp?ID=47
 
 http://badmanstropicalfish.com/fish_palace/lymphocystis_tomchoi.html
 
 
 TC  &  regards                

 
 Kudos  to  you  Krash.  Great  info  buddy.     Rock On   
 
 Wish  the  firemouth  a  speedy  recovery.   Smile
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sssram
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2011 6:56 pm Post subject: Re: what is wrong? - firemouth cichlid Reply with quote

 Hello  all,
 
 Link  to  see  the  Firemouth's  present  condition
 
 http://i.imgur.com/iZgUj.jpg
 http://i.imgur.com/qJb2S.jpg
 http://i.imgur.com/oEpEh.jpg
 
 sssram
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krash
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 26, 2011 1:16 am Post subject: Re: what is wrong? - firemouth cichlid Reply with quote

 Hi  SSSram,
 
 Great  news  that  he  is  improving,  i  think  he  is  on  the  road  to  recovery.  I  saw  you  snaps  &  you  right  even  the  ulceration  near  his  gills  are  not  visible.
 
 Few  steps  that  you  should  continue:-
 
 1)  continue  the  WC  -  keeps  the  water  parameters  nice  &  healthy,  his  immunity  will  be  better  in  fighting  of  the  infection.
 2)   Once  you  see  the  growths  have  subsided  substantially  you  can  reduce  your  WC  to  20%  a  day  or  50%  once  every  3  days.
 3)  Continue  with  methylene  blue,  its  useful
 4)  Keep  his  stress  levels  low,  by  keeping  lights  off  when  not  required,  keeping  the  quarantine  tank  in  place  where  he  wont  be  disturbed.
 5)  try  to  feed  him,  if  he  doesn't  remove  the  food  with  a  net,  wait  for  2  days  &  try  again,  also  that  fact  that  he  is  in  a  qurantine  tank  he  is  going  to  be  a  bit  scared;  make  him  comfortable  &  he  should  start  eating.  Also  the  appetite  will  build  up  as  the  infection  subsides.
 6)  Adding  baby  sword  tails  is  ok,  just  make  sure  they  are  healthy,  at  the  stage  he  is  in  its  easy  to  catch  on  parasites  &  other  bacterial  infections  from  carrier  fishes.  would  be  better  if  you  could  wait  a  little  longer  before  adding  them.
 
 Its  should  take  about  couple  of  weeks  for  his  symptoms  to  subside,  &  he  starts  behaving  &  appearing  normal  again.  
 
 Yes  he  can  be  added  to  the  tank,  but  its  recommended  that  the  fish  after  recovery  is  quarantined  for  a  month  before  adding  him  back  to  the  tank.  This  is  to  prevent  the  virus  break-out  happening  in  the  main  tank  as  they  can  carry  the  virus  after  recovery  &  might  infect  a  weak  or  susceptible  fish  in  the  main  tank.  Also  this  guy  will  regain  his  strength  &  health  kept  away  from  competitive  environment  in  the  main  tank.
 
 Yes  he  might  have  to  live  with  a  bad  scar,  but  looking  at  you  pics  I  think  he  might  just  have  mild  scar,  again  depends  to  the  extend  of  damage  done  by  the  virus.  But  he  sure  will  be  a  lucky  cichlid  to  have  an  owner  like  you.
 
 ATB,  happy  for  your  firemouth  Smile  
 
 
 @  Kastor48252   
 
 Thank  you,
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Romi
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:45 am Post subject: Re: what is wrong? - firemouth cichlid Reply with quote

 good  livefood  like  compost  worms  help  fish  with  healing  wounds  recover  fast.
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sssram
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2011 6:41 am Post subject: Re: what is wrong? - firemouth cichlid Reply with quote

 He  is  further  improving.  Has  started  taking  food  a  bit  and  moving  around  the  tank.
 thankyou  for  all  the  advice  and  info.
 
 sssram
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:02 am Post subject: Re: what is wrong? - firemouth cichlid Reply with quote

                                                   
sssram  wrote  (View  Post):                
He  is  further  improving.  Has  started  taking  food  a  bit  and  moving  around  the  tank.
 thankyou  for  all  the  advice  and  info.
 
 sssram                

 
 Your  welcome,  That  is  a  good  news  Smile  
 
 since  he  has  started  taking  food  ,  will  recommend  you  feed  quality  pellets  with  vitamins  &  trace  minerals.  Also  avoid  a  high  protein  diet  for  a  month.  You  will  see  the  improvement  much  quicker.
 
 Regards
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