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http://indianaquariumhobbyist.com/community/ :: View topic - Enough for a marine tank ?
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Enough for a marine tank ?
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rahulk
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:44 pm Post subject: Enough for a marine tank ? Reply with quote

 I  have  a  36x18x12    all  galss  tank,  Will  this  be  sufficient  for  a  marine  set  up?  I  would  be  setting  up  a  sump  for  the  extra  water  capacity,
 
 I  know  a  bigger  tank  will  be  better,  but  have  a  space  constraint  living  in  a  flat.
 
 Plans  for  the  tank:-
 
 1)  Fish  with  live  rocks
 2)  a  in  sump  skimmer
 3)  small  fishes  which  are  around  ~2"  (max  5  no:)
 4)  No  inverts,  except  may  be  a  turbo  snail  (and  LR  hitch  hikers)
 3)  good  lighting  for  coralline  (since  the  height  of  the  tank  is  less  ,  Probably  need  less  light)
 4)  Thin  layer  of  coral  sand
 
 
 Will  this  work  ?
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aquascapes
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 9:03 pm Post subject:  Reply with quote

 Hi  Rahul,
 welcome  to  the  salt  hobby!
 well  I'd  like  to  mention  this  here  that  for  that  when  you  say  a  marine  tank  than  it  should  be  the  biggest  in  your  collection!
 a  big  tank  definately  has  it's  advantages.  However,  if  you  feel  the  size  that  you  mention  is  the  biggest  you  can  accomodate  -  so  be  it!
 I'm  pleased  that  you  are  doing  your  homework!  and  are  reading  on  the  subject!  you  are  also  planning  for  a  sump  which  is  a  very  wise  decision  -  good  idea!
 
                                                 
Quote:                
3)  good  lighting  for  coralline  (since  the  height  of  the  tank  is  less  ,  Probably  need  less  light)                  

 What  you  are  trying  to  say  here  is  that  you  don't  need  fancy  lights  like  a  MH  and  can  do  with  Floroscent  lighting  like  a  pl/cfl  +  actinics  -  right?
 Sorry  had  to  mention  this  or  a  new  comer  might  get  misguided!
 Well,  coralline  growth  is  good  in  the  range  of  14000K  and  will  also  require  water  additives  to  multiply!
 
                                                 
Quote:                
4)  Thin  layer  of  coral  sand                  

 fine!
 It  will  work!
 wish  you  all  the  best  -  any  other  doubts  -  put  them  here!
 regards
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rahulk
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 8:30 am Post subject:  Reply with quote

                                                   
Quote:                
What  you  are  trying  to  say  here  is  that  you  don't  need  fancy  lights  like  a  MH  and  can  do  with  Floroscent  lighting  like  a  pl/cfl  +  actinics  -  right?  
 Sorry  had  to  mention  this  or  a  new  comer  might  get  misguided!  
 Well,  coralline  growth  is  good  in  the  range  of  14000K  and  will  also  require  water  additives  to  multiply!  
                 

 
 Hi  Aquascapes,
       Thanks  for  your  suggestion,
 What  type  of  lighting  do  you  suggest  for  this  set  up?
 
 
 I  am  working  out  some  options  for  accomodating  a  taller  tank,  trying  to  get  the  height  of  tank  to  2  feet  which  is  presently  1  foot.
 
 
 What  should  be  the  lighting  options  for  2  feet  high  tank,  Since  less  light  penetrates  as  height  increases  ,  What  if  i  keep  the  LR's  higher  up  (closer  to  the  surface)
 
 
 Thanks  &  regards
 Rahul
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rajeev
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 11:17 am Post subject:  Reply with quote

                                                   
rahulk  wrote:                
                                                 
Quote:                
What  you  are  trying  to  say  here  is  that  you  don't  need  fancy  lights  like  a  MH  and  can  do  with  Floroscent  lighting  like  a  pl/cfl  +  actinics  -  right?  
 Sorry  had  to  mention  this  or  a  new  comer  might  get  misguided!  
 Well,  coralline  growth  is  good  in  the  range  of  14000K  and  will  also  require  water  additives  to  multiply!  
                 

 
 Hi  Aquascapes,
       Thanks  for  your  suggestion,
 What  type  of  lighting  do  you  suggest  for  this  set  up?
 
 
 I  am  working  out  some  options  for  accomodating  a  taller  tank,  trying  to  get  the  height  of  tank  to  2  feet  which  is  presently  1  foot.
 
 
 What  should  be  the  lighting  options  for  2  feet  high  tank,  Since  less  light  penetrates  as  height  increases  ,  What  if  i  keep  the  LR's  higher  up  (closer  to  the  surface)
 
 
 Thanks  &  regards
 Rahul                

 
 My  Tank  is  similar  to  your  dimensions  i.e  36x24x12.  I  have  used  a  3  ft  Long  Actinic  blue  light  and  a  10000K  Azoo  PL.  These  lights  do  the  job  quite  well.  I  have  got  some  LR  and  some  hardy  fish.  I  intend  to  make  a  Sump  for  which  I  have  already  constructed  an  overflow.
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aquascapes
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 5:08 pm Post subject:  Reply with quote

                                                   
Quote:                
Hi  Aquascapes,  
 Thanks  for  your  suggestion,  
 What  type  of  lighting  do  you  suggest  for  this  set  up?  
 I  am  working  out  some  options  for  accomodating  a  taller  tank,  trying  to  get  the  height  of  tank  to  2  feet  which  is  presently  1  foot.  
 What  should  be  the  lighting  options  for  2  feet  high  tank,  Since  less  light  penetrates  as  height  increases  ,  What  if  i  keep  the  LR's  higher  up  (closer  to  the  surface)                  

 Hi,
 you  are  most  welcome!
 I  would  suggest  the  below  for  a  2'  high  tank
 Choice  #1  (best  choice)  =  MH  -  (70W)=14000K  in  combi  with  an  actinic  2'  (18W).  OR  MH  -  (70W)=20000k
 
 Choice  #2  =  Hi-pl  (the  one  that  Rajeev  suggests  is  a  pl  of  36W)  I  would  suggest  2  hi-pl  of  18W  each  with  an  out  put  of  14000K  in  combi  with  an  actinic  -3'
 
 Choice  #3  =  (not  very  appealing)  =  Hi-pl  (the  one  that  Rajeev  suggests)  1  Hi-pl  of  36W  out  put  =  10000K  +  actinic  blue  3'
 
 I  would  like  to  suggest  one  more  thing  that  your  belief  of  light  penetration  is  a  bit  faulty.  Light  with  a  higher  rating  on  the  Kelvin  chart  will  penetrate  deeper  irrespective  of  the  watts!
 In  short  -  blue  light  penetrates  deeper  while  the  red  or  yellow  light  cannot  penetrate  much  below  the  surface.
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rahulk
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 23, 2006 5:20 pm Post subject:  Reply with quote

 What  Does  PL  stand  for?  What  else  do  i  require  to  run  this  ex:  ballast,  holder  ....
 
 Where  can  i  source  this  from  ?
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psimhan
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 23, 2006 7:24 pm Post subject:  Reply with quote

 PL/CFL/PC  are  compact  fluorescents.  You  can  either  get  the  CFLs  with  built  in  ballast  and  choke  e.g  your  normal  power  savings  bulbs.  These  are  expensive  though.
 Alternatively  you  can  get  the  PLs  which  come  with  external  choke  and  ballast  and  only  need  the  bulbs  to  be  replaced-  cheaper  in  the  long  run.
 You  can  probably  get  it  from  BVK  Iyengar  road.
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rahulk
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2006 7:40 am Post subject:  Reply with quote

 Hi  
 
         What  if  i  put  a  150  watts  20000k  light  in  a  2'  high  tank  ,  Would  this  be  too  much  light  ?
 
 Aquascapes  had  mentiones  70  watts  20000k  would  be  good  ,  But  i  have  a  150  watts  ballast  ,  will  i  hvae  to  keep  the  lights  higher  up  to  avoid  the  LR  from  bleaching?  
 
 suggestions  please.  What  should  the  height  of  the  lights  be  from  the  water  surface  for  this  wattage  and  tank  size  of  3x2x2(feet)  ?
 
 Rahul
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thenobel1
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2006 9:55 am Post subject:  Reply with quote

 how  do  you  actually  check  the  kelvin  of  a  bulb  have  3  spare  osram  CFL's  11  w,  even  read  the  litrature  there  was  no  mention  of  kelvin  of  the  bulb...can  i  use  these  for  my  tank??
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rahulk
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2006 12:39 pm Post subject:  Reply with quote

 What  is  written  on  your  bulb?  check  the  company  website  if  you  can.
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aquascapes
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2006 4:52 pm Post subject:  Reply with quote

                                                   
Quote:                
What  if  i  put  a  150  watts  20000k  light  in  a  2'  high  tank  ,  Would  this  be  too  much  light  ?                  

 Actually  it  is  not  the  higher  watts  of  light  that  penetrates  deeper  -  it  is  the  colour  temp.  of  the  light  which  is  responsible  for  it!
 The  higher  rating  on  the  Kelvin  chart  the  deeper  it  penetrates.
 
                                                 
Quote:                
suggestions  please.  What  should  the  height  of  the  lights  be  from  the  water  surface  for  this  wattage  and  tank  size  of  3x2x2(feet)  ?                  

 Rahul,  actually  for  the  tank  size  that  you  mention  'now'  the  150W  MH  will  be  sufficient  enough  but  the  use  of  actinics  along  with  the  MH  becomes  mandatory  if  you  are  using  a  MH  tube  of  14000K  or  below.
 
                                                 
Quote:                
Aquascapes  had  mentiones  70  watts  20000k  would  be  good  ,  But  i  have  a  150  watts  ballast  ,  will  i  hvae  to  keep  the  lights  higher  up  to  avoid  the  LR  from  bleaching?                  

 Ideally  a  well  ventilated  canopy  is  all  that  is  required  for  the  MH  not  heating  up  the  water  too  much.
 A  chiller  if  possible  is  by-far  the  best  combination  with  a  MH  but,  if  the  pocket  does  not  permit  that  expense  you  can  use  cooling  fans  to  reduce  the  temp.  by  approx.  4-5*  C  
 
 @Krishna,
 
                                                 
Quote:                
how  do  you  actually  check  the  kelvin  of  a  bulb  have  3  spare  osram  CFL's  11  w,  even  read  the  litrature  there  was  no  mention  of  kelvin  of  the  bulb...can  i  use  these  for  my  tank??                

 I  think  you  probably  have  the  6500K  bulbs  check  with  the  manufacturer  and  see!
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Richards
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2006 7:27 pm Post subject:  Reply with quote

 Hello  guys  i  am  not  an  expert  but  these  are  my  suggestions  and  observations.(Purely  on  personal  experience).
 
 I  take  it  for  granted  its  just  FOWLR  tank.
 
 1.  Just  for  a  tank  of  3  feet  spending  on  MH  is  a  bit  costlier.  It  requires  a  good  ballast  and  electrical  setup,  a  good  aerated  canopy(if  required),  daily  topoff  water  increases,  unwanted  algae  blooms  because  of  strong  lightings,  fishes  get  easily  stressed  in  a  small  setup.
 
 2.All  th  LR  can  be  sustained  with  minimal  lighting  and  maximum  water  flow.
 
 3.Moreover  if  u  r  goin  to  have  just  5  fishes  there  is  absoluetly  no  need  for  u  to  have  MH.
 
 Here  are  my  suggestions  for  the  lighting  in  a  FOWLR  of  your  size.
 1.  Get  one  good  10k  lighting  20W  is  more  than  enough  to  see  the  fishes  and  its  colurings
 2.  Get  PC  blue  lighting  may  be  40w  2  nos(Good  actnic  if  possible)
 3.  One  moon  light  for  night  watching  
 
 My  observations
 
 I  do  all  kinds  of  research  work  in  my  10  gallon  its  height  is  1  1/2  feet.
 I  used  two  20W  PC  blue  lamps  which  i  purchased  from  Parrys  corner,chennai  (40  Rs  Each)  and  a  400l  power  head  for  circulation
 My  LR  coralline  growth  was  enormous  u  will  see  it  in  two  weeks  with  this  kind  of  lighting  itself.
 
 For  MH  of  75w  to  150  watts  i  would  recommend  a  height  of  a  minimum  1  ft.  since  we  live  in  a  tropical  country  things  can  get  really  hot  here.
 
 For  any  queries  do  call  me  at
 9941363186
 04427482560
 or  
 Mail  me  at  prsathishraj  [at]  yahoo  [dot]  com
 
 Regards
 Richards
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thenobel1
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2006 8:57 pm Post subject:  Reply with quote

 @Nauzer  Bhai,
 
 
                                                 
Quote:                
Actually  it  is  not  the  higher  watts  of  light  that  penetrates  deeper  -  it  is  the  colour  temp.  of  the  light  which  is  responsible  for  it!
 The  higher  rating  on  the  Kelvin  chart  the  deeper  it  penetrates.                

 
 Does  this  mean  insted  of  using  two  10000k  70  w  MH  i  coud  use  a  single  20000k  150  w  or  70  w
 
 
                                                 
Quote:                
I  think  you  probably  have  the  6500K  bulbs  check  with  the  manufacturer  and  see!                

 
 Checked  with  the  osram  guys  ,    told  me  they  have  daylight  bulb  guess  it  is  6500k  ,  had  also  enquired  about  the  10000-20000k  MH's  the  guy  didn't  have  any  clue  about  what  i  was  talking  about  finally  had  to  tell  him  "bhayya  blue  light  dene  walaa  MH"    Chuckle  lol    and  he  told  me  to  check  back  tommorow  
 
   saw  an  inscect  killer  on  my  stroll  to  the  nearby  sweetshop  the  light's  used  by  the  machines  look's  somwhat  similar  to  Actinic's.....comments?????
 
 @Richard,
     
 
 
                                                 
Quote:                
Just  for  a  tank  of  3  feet  spending  on  MH  is  a  bit  costlier.  It  requires  a  good  ballast  and  electrical  setup,  a  good  aerated  canopy(if  required),  daily  topoff  water  increases,  unwanted  algae  blooms  because  of  strong  lightings,  fishes  get  easily  stressed  in  a  small  setup.                  

 
 Sir  i  completly  agree  with  what  you  have  said  ,  MH  is  do  consume  a  lot  of  electricity  and  recently  had  borrowed  a  Mh  fitting  from  my  frendly  nebourhood  tent  walla  just  to  have  an  idea  of  how  much  light  does  it  really  make  and  ended  up  with  lot  of  black  deposit  on  the  wall  behind  the  hood.  Sad  
 
 
                                                 
Quote:                
 Get  one  good  10k  lighting  20W  is  more  than  enough  to  see  the  fishes  and  its  colurings                

 
   do  you  know  any  10  k  20  w  light  u  can  pick  up  from  the  electrical  store?
 
 Cheerz
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cokeamod
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2006 10:51 pm Post subject:  Reply with quote

 Good  observation  noblebhai!
 Even  i  was  wondering  about  the  insect  killer  ones,  cause  i  dont  think  they  are  too  costly!
 Infact  i  had  started  a  post  about  kelvin  ratings  of  different  tubes.
 Regards,
 amod.
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rahulk
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 6:55 am Post subject:  Reply with quote

                                                   
Quote:                
Actually  it  is  not  the  higher  watts  of  light  that  penetrates  deeper  -  it  is  the  colour  temp.  of  the  light  which  is  responsible  for  it!  
 The  higher  rating  on  the  Kelvin  chart  the  deeper  it  penetrates.  
                 

 
 
 I  totally  agree  that  it  is  the  blue  side  of  the  blackbody  spectrum  that  penetrates  deeper,  Sorry!  i  goofed  up  the  question  ,  Let  me  re-phrase.
 with  a  150  watts  MH  at  1  feet  above  the  water  surface,  will  the  intensity  of  light  be  excessive  ?
 
 How  does  one  estimate  the  intensity  needed  for  a  particular  set  up  ?  do  we  use  the  thumb  rule  of  watts  per  gallon?  
 
 How  many  watts  per  gallon  would  i  need  for  a  60  gallon  tank?  Is  it  better  to  use  one  lamp  with  higher  intensity  or  several  lamps  of  lower  intensity  ?
 i  assume  that  intensity  directly  relates  with  the  wattage  of  the  lamp  used.
 
 
 
                                                 
Quote:                
Rahul,  actually  for  the  tank  size  that  you  mention  'now'  the  150W  MH  will  be  sufficient  enough  but  the  use  of  actinics  along  with  the  MH  becomes  mandatory  if  you  are  using  a  MH  tube  of  14000K  or  below.  
                 

 
 
 I  have  decided  to  go  with  20,000  k  150  watts  MH  lamp,  with  1  actinic(wattage  ?)  and  20  watts  of  6500  k  tube  (viewing  purpose  only,  will  be  ON  only  while  viewing  the  tank)
 
 
 Aquascapes  any  improvements  on  this  ?
 Thanks  you
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