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http://indianaquariumhobbyist.com/community/ :: View topic - Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice
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Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice
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nash81
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2009 8:57 pm Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

                                                   
aquascapes  wrote  (View  Post):                
Nirav,  I  understand  your  frustration  as  I  myself  have  gone  through  the  same  money  busting  trauma  with  LEDs  and  will  shortly  be  ready  with  a  light  that  is  programmed  to  perform  according  to  the  lunar  cycle  (including  moon  light).  Yes,  it  is  expensive  as  the  micro  processors  and  the  circuts  and  the  LED  themselves  are  expensive  but,  I  am  not  talking  about  controlled  lights  here  it  can  just  be  normal  1w  LEDs  and  for  his  tank  size  the  cost  should  not  exceed  more  than  5k  now  that  is  cheap  compared  to  any  chiller  even  the  chinese  ones  and  the  operational  cost  of  a  MH+chiller  compared  to  the  operating  cost  of  LED  lights  would  be  a  blessing!  One  more  reason  for  stressing  the  point  on  LED  is  his  tank's  height  is  not  more  than  1'  so  he  does  not  need  the  hi-power  ones.  BTW,  if  LED  is  a  hassel  I  guess  we  have  a  lot  of  options  for  the  lighting  with  10000K  and  14000K  cfls  and  even  T5s!                

 
 Sir,  if  experienced  hobbyist  like  us  are  going  through  the  trouble,  think  what  a  first  timer  will  go  through  with  an  LED.  You  and  me  will  restart  even  if  we  blow  a  few  LED's  since  we  like  to  experiment  and  have  the  resources  to  experiment.  Imagine  a  persons  frustration  when  he  goes  ahead  with  our  suggestion  and  gets  an  incorrect  LED  driver  or  over  runs  it  and  blows  the  LEDs,  he  will  have  to  buy  more  LED's  and  eventually  a  lot  more  cost.  My  idea  and  intent  is  that  many  hobbyist  have  tried  their  hands  on  marine  tanks  and  most  of  them  have  not  had  longterm  success,  due  to  some  basic  steps  going  wrong.  Like  higher  temperature,  missing  on  water  changes,  etc.  I  think  t5's  would  be  a  cool  option  and  also  the  CFL's  but  here  again  heat  will  be  the  issue.  We  both  know  LED  is  the  future,  however  is  NOW  the  right  time  for  it,  i  still  have  my  doubts.
 
 Cheers
 Nirav  Shah
 Indiapetstore.com
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aquascapes
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2009 10:11 pm Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

 Nirav,
 please  excuse  me  if  I  was  not  able  to  express  myself  better  but,  I  never  said  anything  about  'making'  the  lights  he  could  just  buy  the  ready-made  LEDs  with  fixture  even  from  the  internet.  Was  just  a  suggestion,  I  don't  have  any  grudges  against  MHs  or  anything  but,  since  it  is  a  small  tank  I  thought  out  loud  that  LEDs  would  not  be  that  expensive  for  it.
 BTW,  please  don't  sir  me  makes  me  feel  nervous  we  all  are  students  here  but,  in  different  standards!
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aquascaper
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:01 pm Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

 @  aquascapes  ....  the  deen  of  the  university  is  calling  himself  a  student  Smile)  hahahaha  ....  good  going  sirrrrrrrrr
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Nonza
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 3:51 am Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

 Hey  Aquamarine,
 
 Curious  to  know  what  you  finally  decided  to  go  with?  or  have  you?
 
 Here's  my  2  cents  on  lighting,  (i  don't  know  if  people  with  agree  with  this),
 
 If  growing  coralline  algae  is  your  objective,  you  wouldn't  need  powerful  lighting,  just  light  in  the  bluish  spectrum.  With  this  you  could  also  keep  soft  corals  like  mushrooms,  placed  higher  up  towards  the  surface  (depending  on  how  powerful  the  lights  are)
 
 Good  luck
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neoaqua
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 12:28 pm Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

 I  am  really  curious  to  know  what  aquamarine  is  doing.  Anyway,  I'll  pick  it  up  from  here.  I  have  a  1  ft  cube  as  a  quarantine  for  a  pair  of  amazon  puffers.  When  they  move  into  their  3*1*1  ft,  I'll  try  to  set  up  a  nano  marine  in  this.  I'll  just  use  dead  rock,  coral  sand  for  starters  and  take  it  up  from  there.  I  am  fully  aware  that  the  tank  may  crash,  but  without  doing,  I'll  never  know!
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 5:59 pm Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

 Avi,
 all  the  best!
 do  start  your  thread  and  put  your  plans  there..  I'm  sure  we  would  like  to  see  a  beautiful  nano  tank!
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neoaqua
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 11:50 am Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

 Hi  Nauzer,  
 
 Thanks  for  the  heads  up.  I  have  been  reading  about  this  a  lot.  I  have  two  options.  The  easiest  is  to  have  what  you  call  a  coral  graveyard  and  keep  a  damsel  (blue  devil  or  azure).  The  challenge  is  to  get  a  beautiful  pseudo-reef  (no  frags  or  LR  as  they  are  banned).  
 
 Since  this  is  my  very  first  "getting  my  feet  wet",  I'll  start  with  the  option  with  the  damsel.  Also  because  of  practical  difficulties.  I  have  left  Kolkata  (and  all  my  aquariums)  and  staying  on  rent,  so  shifting  periodically  is  inevitable.  As  I  gain  more  experience,  I'll  look  into  other  options.  A  few  questions:
 
 Does  ordinary  coral  sand  introduce  phosphates,  nitrates  and  silicates?  How  do  you  eradicate  them  other  than  weekly  10%  water  change?  Any  products  like  Phoszorb  or  phosphate/silicate  removing  pads?  I  think  this  is  very  important  in  a  small  tank.
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nash81
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 1:22 pm Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

                                                   
Quote:                
Does  ordinary  coral  sand  introduce  phosphates,  nitrates  and  silicates?  How  do  you  eradicate  them  other  than  weekly  10%  water  change?  Any  products  like  Phoszorb  or  phosphate/silicate  removing  pads?  I  think  this  is  very  important  in  a  small  tank.                

 
 This  would  largely  come  more  from  your  water,  If  you  use  RO,  you  can  keep  them  down  to  the  minimum.  Coral  sand  typically  should  not  have  these.  Nitrates  is  a  byproduct  of  the  cycling  and  will  come  automatically.
 
 Yes  there  are  filter  mediums  available  to  get  rid  of  the  three.  Major  companies  like  Seachem,  Kent  Marine,  Sera  make  them.
 
 Warm  Regards
 Nirav  Shah
 Indiapetstore.com
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aquascapes
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 3:59 pm Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

 Avi,
 I  have  always  believed  in  the  natural  system  of  both  fish  keeping  and  reef  keeping.  If  you  ask  me  I  would  rather  avoid  the  problem  than  to  take  remedial  actions  later  on!
 YES  the  source  from  which  the  coral  sand  is  acquired  is  importantly  responsible  for  the  nitrate,  phosphate  leeching  into  the  tank  water.  There  are  ready  packs  available  from  reputed  companies  which  can  be  used  without  much  tension  (since  you  are  planning  for  a  nano  I  guess  you  could  also  afford  to  opt  for  aragonite  sand).
 WRT  silicates  yes  a  RO/DI  source  of  water  can  be  arranged  (you  could  also  take  the  water  from  the  household  RO  filter  which  is  available  for  purifying  drinking  water  since  the  tank  size  is  not  big)  to  ensure  that  the  water  contains  less  silicates.
 
                                                 
Quote:                
The  easiest  is  to  have  what  you  call  a  coral  graveyard  and  keep  a  damsel  (blue  devil  or  azure).  The  challenge  is  to  get  a  beautiful  pseudo-reef  (no  frags  or  LR  as  they  are  banned).                  

 IMO  the  graveyard  was  more  difficult  to  maintain!!
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neoaqua
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 12:11 am Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

 Ya  Nauzer,  thats  because  building  complete  great  systems  is  child's  play  to  you!  
 
 Now  coming  from  the  concepts  to  the  nuts  and  bolts  part,  here  are  a  few  more  queries.
 
 1.  How  do  you  measure  salt  for  actual  use,  particularly  for  small  quantities  of  water  for  weekly  water  change?
 2.  How  often   is  it  necessary  to  test  water  parameters?  This  is  not  a  reef  tank.
 3.  Is  there  a  need  for  a  hood?  Or  canopies  like  THIS  are  sufficient.  This  may  be  cooler  as  all  sides  are  open.
 4.  Is  base  rock  necessary  or  can  live  rocks  be  put  directly  on  the  glass  floor?
 5.  Is  it  necessary  to  brush  off  algae  from  live  rock  or  let  it  grow  for  inverts  that  may  come  months  later?
 6.  Can  fresh  water  food  like  algae  wafer,  spirulina  granulat  etc  given  to  marine  algae  grazing  inverts?
 7.  Is  it  correct  that  Aragonite  should  be  used  for  DSB  only  or  else  it  will  become  nutrient  basin?
 8.  According  to  some  forums  the  phosphate  removers  do  not  work.  The  only  way  is  to  change  water  source  and  stop  additives,  vitamins  etc.  Is  this  correct?
 
 Thanks  in  advance  for  your  patience.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 5:29 pm Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

 Hi,  are  these  questions  too  basic  or  foolish  to  get  an  answer  or  is  everyone  busy?
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 2:26 am Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

 Hello,
 
 Here's  my  opinion  from  my  experiences,  if  anyone  disagrees,  feel  free  to  correct....
 
 1.  How  do  you  measure  salt  for  actual  use,  particularly  for  small  quantities  of  water  for  weekly  water  change?
 >>  Swing  Arm  Hydrometer  or  better,  a  Refractometer...  hope  this  answers  the  question
 
 2.  How  often   is  it  necessary  to  test  water  parameters?  This  is  not  a  reef  tank.
 >>  Depends  on  how  it  looks  and  what  you've  added  extra  in  terms  of  bioload.  Typically,  you  would  test  weekly  at  least  in  the  fisrt  couple  of  months.  Once  settled,  and  everything  looks  good,  you  may  not  feel  the  need  to.
 
 3.  Is  there  a  need  for  a  hood?  Or  canopies  like  THIS  are  sufficient.  This  may  be  cooler  as  all  sides  are  open.
 >>  The  hood  prevents  excess  evaporation  and  protects  "jumpers".  However,  the  tank  will  run  hotter.  I  like  open  tops.  Pretty  much  like  the  link  you've  attached
 
 4.  Is  base  rock  necessary  or  can  live  rocks  be  put  directly  on  the  glass  floor?
 >>  live  rock  directly  is  fine,  as  long  as  you  don't  crack  the  glass  and  the  structure  is  stable.
 
 5.  Is  it  necessary  to  brush  off  algae  from  live  rock  or  let  it  grow  for  inverts  that  may  come  months  later?
 >>  If  the  algal  look  doesn't  bother  you,  IMO  better  to  leave  it  (debatable),  more  natural  and  probably  a  better  cycle.
 
 6.  Can  fresh  water  food  like  algae  wafer,  spirulina  granulat  etc  given  to  marine  algae  grazing  inverts?
 >>  No  problems  with  this,  have  fed  a  regal  tang  with  tetra  bits  recommended  for  discus  for  5  years   Very Happy  
 
 7.  Is  it  correct  that  Aragonite  should  be  used  for  DSB  only  or  else  it  will  become  nutrient  basin?
 >>  Aragonite  may  be  used  as  a  substrate  like  any  other  i.e.  crushed  coral.  Best  for  DSB,  3  inch  minimum.
 
 8.  According  to  some  forums  the  phosphate  removers  do  not  work.  The  only  way  is  to  change  water  source  and  stop  additives,  vitamins  etc.  Is  this  correct?
 >>  Honestly,  for  a  tank  the  size  of  yours,  do  a  15-20%  water  change  with  RO/DI  water  every  week  and  forget  about  the  vitamins,  additives  etc.
 Your  salt  mix  is  premixed  to  attain  desirable  levels.  IMO  phosphate  removers  (RowaPhos)  works  pretty  good.
 
 
 Hope  this  helps!
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 9:23 am Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

 Hi  Nonza,  thanks  a  lot.  I  think  I'll  rephrase  the  first  question.  What  I  meant  is  whether  there  is  any  standard  measure  for  a  cup  or  something  like  that,  otherwise  how  will  I  put  it  in  a  20  L  bucket  to  start  with?  If  its  less,  I  can  add,  but  if  its  more,  then  there's  a  problem!  I  guess  I  have  to  take  a  30L  bucket  to  male  a  20L  mix.  Do  you  guys  have  a  small  electronic  weighing  machine?
 
 Also  can  I  use  Bisleri  water  (says  added  magnesium  and  ptassium),  do  not  know  if  it  will  lead  to  chloride  deposit.
 
 Is  RowaPhos  available  in  India?  Then  I  can  use  tap  water  after  using  Ammolock  and  Stresszyme,  if  bottled  water  is  not  suitable.
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Nonza
Frequent Visitor to IAH
Frequent Visitor to IAH



Joined: Sep 13, 2009
Posts: 183
Location: Mumbai

Status: Offline
PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 12:27 pm Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

 Hello,
 
 1.  To  be  perfectly  honest,  have  never  actually  measured  how  much  water  and  how  much  salt   Smile  .  Can't  really  help  you  there.
 
 2.  I  use  a  RO/DI  unit  myself,  so  am  not  familiar  as  to  what  brands  of  distilled  water  is  better.  But  I'm  pretty  sure  that  you'll  get  an  answer  for  that  from  the  ones  that  do  use.  On  a  side  note,  I  think  some  of  the  household  RO  unit  suppliers  (KENT/  Aquaguard)  use  silver  particles  for  bacteria  in  some  of  their  units.  That  was  enough  to  put  me  off.
 
 3.  For  RowaPhos...  check  out  www.reefdepot.sg  or  http://freshnmarine.com.sg/estore/.  Based  in  singapore.
 
 Good  luck!!!
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aquascapes
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Joined: Dec 19, 2005
Posts: 2753
Location: Surat, Gujarat

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 10:48 pm Post subject: Re: Planning 7G Aquarium, need specific advice Reply with quote

 @avi,
 sorry  for  the  late  reply!
 
                                                 
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Ya  Nauzer,  thats  because  building  complete  great  systems  is  child's  play  to  you!                

 No  sir  it  is  my  business  and  I  do  take  up  my  business  seriously!   Smile  
 
                                                 
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1.  How  do  you  measure  salt  for  actual  use,  particularly  for  small  quantities  of  water  for  weekly  water  change?                  

 I  would  recommend  you  not  to  administer  weekly  water  changes  if  you  don't  require  them.  It  will  just  be  an  overkill.  I  mean  why  in  the  world  would  we  think  of  nitrifying  and  de-nitrifying  bacteria  if  we  want  to  do  weekly  water  changes?  I  guess  you  don't  even  need  LRs  if  you  do  partial  water  changes  every  week.  Now,  please  don't  mis-understand  me  all  I  am  trying  to  say  is  to  be  wise  and  change  the  water  only  when  you  require  to  do  so.  1  Kg  of  salt  makes  30  ltrs.  of  water  which  should  not  be  difficult  to  measure.
 
                                                 
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2.  How  often   is  it  necessary  to  test  water  parameters?  This  is  not  a  reef  tank.                

 Till  you  don't  see  something  you  have  to  feel  it  to  know  what  it  is!
 Your  tank  will  talk  to  you....till  you  understand  the  language  you  have  to  test  the  water  to  know  what  it  is  trying  to  tell  you!
 I  would  say  as  a  beginner  you  should  check  the  parameters  say  once  every  week.
 
                                                 
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Is  there  a  need  for  a  hood?  Or  canopies  like  THIS  are  sufficient.  This  may  be  cooler  as  all  sides  are  open.                

 I  would  prefer  a  well  ventilated  canopy  rather  than  a  open  top  as  I  have  lost  a  few  fish  (jumpers)  in  my  open  top.
 
                                                 
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Is  base  rock  necessary  or  can  live  rocks  be  put  directly  on  the  glass  floor?                

 Base  rocks  are  just  fillers  that  save  you  money  since  your  tank  is  not  big  you  don't  need  them.  I  would  rater  suggest  a  rock  structure  either  using  pvc  pipes  and  cable  ties  or  egg  crates  with  pvc  pipes.
 
                                                 
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Is  it  necessary  to  brush  off  algae  from  live  rock  or  let  it  grow  for  inverts  that  may  come  months  later?                

 No  let  it  be!
 
                                                 
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Can  fresh  water  food  like  algae  wafer,  spirulina  granulat  etc  given  to  marine  algae  grazing  inverts                

 In  emergencies  you  can  but,  generally  I  would  advise  you  to  stick  to  specialized  fish  feeds.
 
                                                 
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Is  it  correct  that  Aragonite  should  be  used  for  DSB  only  or  else  it  will  become  nutrient  basin?                

 nothing  should  be  used  without  a  good  thought..Every  coin  has  two  sides.  I  would  suggest  a  good  0.5"  to  1"  layer  of  sand  in  the  tank  should  not  be  a  problem.
 
                                                 
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According  to  some  forums  the  phosphate  removers  do  not  work.  The  only  way  is  to  change  water  source  and  stop  additives,  vitamins  etc.  Is  this  correct?                
 
 I  personally  have  not  used  any  phosphate  removers  so  cannot  comment  on  their  efficiency  but,  again  prevention  is  better  than  cure  test  your  sorce  water  before  hand  to  avoid  problems  at  a  later  stage  and  if  you  are  not  going  in  for  a  reef  tank  why  do  you  need  to  add  additives?
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