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http://indianaquariumhobbyist.com/community/ :: View topic - Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help
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Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help
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Discusolic
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 21, 2012 11:58 am Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 Suman  ,
 
 As  per  the  latest  pics  of  your  discus,  it  looks  like  the  membrane  of  one  side  of  the  gill  ,  which  is   underside  of  the  operculum  has  infection  .It   may  be  the  case  of  bacteria  infection   of  the  gill  tissue  underneath  .  Once  the  membrance  is  damaged  the  functioning  of  the  gills  will  not  be  proper  because  the  suction  to  pull  air  /  water  from  mouth  through  its  filaments  resulting  in  drop  in  oxygen  absorbtion  .
 
 Please  ensure  you  provide  extra  aeration  and  very  good  water  quality  .  Pl  note  to  treat  white  shit  we  had  increased  the  temp  to  32deg  and  there  may  be  drop  in  oxygen  level  which  is  not  good  for  damaged  gills  .  If  white  shit  problem  is  over  you  need  to  bring  down  the  temp  slowly  .  
 
 So  for  damaged  membrane  case  you  need  to  provide  good  aeration  and   good  water  condition  .  In  acute  case  you  need  to  treat  with  Formalin  followed  by  antibiotics  .
 
 Thanks
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SumanG
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2012 5:54 am Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 Thanks  Shiva  for  your  consistent  support!  
 
 Yes,  your  are  absolutely  correct.  The  right  membrane  underneath  the  gill  is  infected.  Normally,  when  in  good  health,  that  membrane  is  transparent  and  barely  visible.  But  in  this  case,  after  the  fish  fell  sick,  membrane  of  both  sides  are  clearly  visible  and  no  longer  transparent,  they  have  become  whitish  .  Also  the  right  membrane  is  disintegrating,  in  the  form  of  tiny  cottony  strands.  I  found  this  while  WC  …  both  in  the  morning  and  evening.
 As  both  gills  are  functioning,  we  can  rule  out  the  occurrence  of  Gill  Fluke  …  if  I  am  correct.
 
 Yes.  We  increased  the  temp  because  of  the  white  poo  issue.  But  that  was  one  time  and  I  did  not  see  any  after  that.
 After  I  read  your  post  in  the  afternoon,  I  lowered  the  temp  to  28.  But  as  it  is  has  around  300  ltrs  of  water  ….  It  will  take  some  time  for  the  temp  to  drop.
 
 Aeration  and  WC  are  going  on  well.  
 
 As  the  situation  is  same  and  the  erosion  of  the  membrane  has  increased,  I  think  by  tomorrow  (Sunday)  night  I  should  start  the  Formalin  treatment.  (in  case  there  is  still  no  improvement).  Will  take  any  chance  for  a  permanent  damage  to  its  gills.   
 Though  I  have  done  PP  treatment  earlier  with  excellent  result  ….   I  am  not  confident  in  Formalin.  
 I  have  also  started  reading  several  old  posts  and  found  one  where  you  have  mentioned  the  procedure:  Praziquantel  Medicine  
 Will  go  for  searching  Formalin  in  chemist  shops  in  the  afternoon  as  the  nearest  LFS  did  not  have  it.
 
 Also  Shiva,  I  have  few  questions  related  to  formalin  treatment:
 
    1. Do  we  have  any  specific  brand  name  we  have  for  Formalin.  Rather  which  one  is  the  best.
     2. The  formalin  dosage  (3  ml  for  100  ltrs  of  water)  is  for  gill  fluke.  Will  it  be  the  same  dosage  here  (bacterial  infection)?
     3. Though  my  other  discuses  in  the  same  tank  are  fine  till  now,  should  they  also  undergo  the  treatment  as  a  precaution?
     4. If  point  no.  3  above  is  ‘Yes’,  shall  I  have  to  clean  the  whole  setup?
     5. What  should  be  the  appropriate  qty  of  water  in  the  hospital  tank.  I  mean  the  more  water  the  better  Or  we  have  any  min  cutoff  (say  60  ltr,  70  ltr  …  )
     6. Given  the  fact  that  using  Formalin  in  high  temperature  is  risky,  shall  I  switch  off  the  heater  in  the  morning.  So  that  by  night  if  I  carry  out  the  treatment,  the  fish  will  be  already  be  acclimated  to  room  temperature.(which  is  25  –  26  degrees)
     7.  Also  as  you  have  mentioned  antibiotics  after  formalin  treatment,  may  I  have  some  posts/referal  site  where  I  can  find  that  information.

 I  am  feeling  embarrassed  for  bombarding  you  with  numerous  questions  but  I  am  desperate  to  get  out  of  this  difficult  situation.  The  discomfort  of  the  sick  fish  is  making  me  crazy.
 
 Regards,
 Suman
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Discusolic
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2012 2:47 pm Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 Suman  ,
 
 Once  the  membrane  underneath  the  operculum  is  damaged  it  will  not  recover  immediately,  in  most  of  the  case  its  not  repairable  .If  the  damage  is  more,  treating  discus  with  Formalin  or  PP  will  be  more  stressfull   to  the  fish.  
 
 I  think  you  should  separate  this  discus  in  to  clinical  tank  and  start  with  formalin  @  3  ml  for  100  lts  dosage  for  24  hrs  with  heavy  aeration  ,  try  to  give   three  dose  in  7  days  time  and  see  if  there  is  any  improvement  .  
 
 Thanks
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ratheeshkollam
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:30 am Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 @SumanG
 
 The  fishes  will  get  well  soon  because  you  are  under  instructions  of  our  great  Shiva.  
 You  just  follwow  what  he  said.  .  the  discus  will  be  in  great  health  with  in  one  week   Thumb Up
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:32 pm Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 Nice  discus  you  have  got  Suman..  Clapping  
 Hope  they  recover  at  the  earliest..
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2012 8:03 pm Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 @Shiva  -  Thanks  a  ton  again!
 
 @Ratheesh  –  I  swear,  I  am  really  out  of  vocabulary  to  praise  Shiva.  Its  really  a  great  relief  to  have  Shiva  on  iah.
 
 @Nandy  –  Thank  a  lot  for  your  compliments  and  good  wishes.
 
 Formalin  Treatment  groundwork:
 1. Cleaned  my  85  ltrs  triangle  tank  thoroughly.
 2. Got  Formalin  from  chemist  shop.
 3. Got  dropper  0.5  ml  accuracy.
 4. Temperature  is  room  temp  –  25-26  degrees.  
 5.  CFL  will  be  on  throughout  except  during  our  sleeping  hours.
 6. No  filters.  Airstone  will  be  on  full  blow.
 7. Water  will  be  from  the  main  tank.
 8. @  3  ml  for  100  ltrs,  I  should  use  2  ml  for   70  ltrs.
 
 
 
 Will  start  the  treatment  tonight.  Keeping  my  fingers  crossed.
 
 Regards,
 Suman
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aquarius
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:21 pm Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 I  would  request  you  to  carry  out  any  treatment  at  a  time  when  you  can  observe  the  fish  throughout  the  treatment  period.
 Night  is  not  the  appropriate  time  in  my  opinion  especially  when  you  are  dealing  with  chemicals  like  formalin  or  PP,  that  too  for  the  first  time.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 8:57 pm Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 Valid  concern  Swarnendu.  But  I  am  a  night  person.  Cannot  spare  time  during  the  day  -  office  office.
 
 Well  Friends,
 
 The  day  one  of  Formalin  treatment  is  going  well.  I  will  update  full  details  after  day  1  is  complete  at  12  o'clock  tonight  with  the  water  change.
 
 Regards,
 Suman
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:29 pm Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 Great  news!
 Keeping  my  fingers  crossed!
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 3:26 am Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 Hello  Everyone,
 
 Heres  the  update  on  the  formalin  treatment:
 
 1.  Hospital  Tank:  85  ltrs.  
 2.  Temperature  is  room  temp  –  25-26  degrees.  
 3.  Airstone  on  full  blow.  
 4.  Formaline  Quantity:  2  ml  for  70  ltrs.  
 5.  70%  WC  after  24  hrs.
 
 Update  on  EOD  Day  1:
 Theres  quite  a  peppering  on  the  discus  which  comes  and  goes.  He  is  secreting  white  wolly  mucus  which  collects  on  the  tank  floor.(pic  added)
 I  think  he  is  gasping  a  bit  less  …  not  sure  though  if  its  my  imagination.  But  the  good  thing  is  that  it  does  not  face  towards  the  water  surface  or  lingers  near  the  surface.
 Offered  some  TetraBits  after  WC  today  but  he  won’t  eat.
 
 Now  break  for  2  days  and  after  that  will  repeat  the  same  procedure.  In  the  mean  time  will  lure  to  have  some  food.
 Some  Images:
 Tank  after  24  hrs  of  Formalin  Treatment
 Close  Up  of  the  Gills
 Wolly  Mucus  on  the  Tank  floor
 
 Regards,
 Suman
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:23 am Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 @SumanG
   Nice  to  hear  that  your  discus  is  improving.
 Also  thanks  for  the  sharing  of  images  so  that  a  new  comer  can  read  and  understand  how  to  use  formaline  efectively.
 Great  work.  Thumb Up
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:39 am Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 Good  to  hear  that  your  Discus  is  improving
 All  the  best   Thumb Up
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 5:16 am Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 More  than  24  hrs  has  passed  since  the  end  of  the  first  day  of  formalin  treatment.
 
 Did  30%  WC.  The  peppering  on  discus  remained  most  of  the  time.  Again  put  some  TetraBits  today  before  WC  but  still  he  won’t  eat.  I  donno  how  he  is  surviving  so  long  without  eating   Sad  
 
 Compared  the  old  videos  with  today's  ....  the  gasping  is  same.  Stayed  most  of  the  time  near  surface  today,  pointing  its  mouth  towards  the  surface.  Still  secreting  white  wolly  mucus  (can  be  seen  in  the  video)  
 Link  to  Video:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdbM-_RXHLw
 Tonight  12  o'clock  will  be  48  hrs  past  the  formlin  treatment.  So  would  be  again  carrying  the  procedure.
 
 Regards,
 Suman


Last edited by SumanG on Fri Jan 27, 2012 1:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 10:43 am Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

                                                   
SumanG  wrote  (View  Post):                
 I  donno  how  he  is  surviving  so  long  without  eating   Sad                  

 
 Do  not  worry!
 I  have  a  few  specimen  who  were  on  hungerstrike  for  more  than  a  month  and  a  half  and  are  now  the  bullies  of  my  tank!!
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 1:12 pm Post subject: Re: Discus Gasping Heavily - Please Help Reply with quote

 2nd  Day  of  Formalin  Treatment  started.
 Its  been  12  hrs  I  started  the  treatment  and  things  are  not  looking  good   Crying or Very sad  .  The  fish  is  turning  towards  the  surface  all  the  time,  does  not  respond  much.  
 
             
Link

 Will  be  doing  WC  at  night  after  completion  of  the  24  hrs  formalin  treatment.
 
 Regards,
 Suman
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