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http://indianaquariumhobbyist.com/community/ :: View topic - The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali
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The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali
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valluvar
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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 12:35 pm Post subject: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 Friends.
 Uploaded  a  few  pictures  of  the  Horadandia  hunt  to  the  gallery.  This  is  part  of  a  series  of  trips  we  have  made  to  the  spot.  
 
 Salient  aspects  :  
 
 the  biotope  is  rainfed  dry  deciduous  scrub  forest.  Most  of  the  catching  was  done  in  heavily  weeded  ponds.  The  water  is  quite  turbid,  heavily  weeded  and  hot  !  It  is  also  quite  hard.  
 
 Some  biotope  images  here,  here,here,  here  and  here.
 
 The  water  body  is  basically  part  of  the  traditional  Coovum-  Chembarambakkam  wet  land  system  and  abounds  with  life.  The  weeds  yielded  
 
 1.  H.Atukorali  (collected)  
 2.  T.Lalius  (collected)  
 3.  R.Caverii  microchepallus  (collected)  
 4.  Channa  Sp  (seen)
 5.  P.Bimaculatus  (seen)  
 6.  Amazing  frogs  and  tadpoles  in  various  stages  of  development.  Suspect  them  to  be  of  Rana  sp  and  Bufo  Sp.
 7.  P.Ranga  (no  canines  so  not  Chanda  sp  )  (Collected)  
 8.  Tons  of  wierd  insect  larve,  Cardinia  sp  (collected)  and  the  giant  yellow  mollusk  (collected)  
 9.  E.Maculatus  (very  cute  and  collected)  
 
 Some  images  of  the  hunt  here,  here  and  here.
 
 It  was  fun,  hot  and  topped  off  with  Beer,  Biryani,  Golden  fried  prawns,  greasy  trans  fat  filled  paratha  and  yellow  dal.  
 
 A  few  images  of  the  critters  once  back  in  bangalore  along  with  RCS  can  be  found  
 
 here.
 
 Cheers,
 Shiv
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Marc
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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 1:06 pm Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 Nice  effort  Shiv,  
 
 Your  P.  bimaculatus  is  P.  vittatus.  
 
 BTW,  you  either  use  caverii  or  microcephalus  for  the  Rasbora  sp.  Go  through  that  Rasbora  thread,  you  will  understand  the  reason  why  Wink
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jabba
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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 1:56 pm Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 Valluvar:  Did  you  come  back  to  Bangalore.  The  tank  for  H  atukorali  is  done  and  waiting  for  them  Very Happy  .  It  is  under  cycling.  I  will  be  posting  the  new  scape  soon
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valluvar
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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 3:11 pm Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 @  marc  :  Thanks.  I  did  not  report  the  Puntius  sp  in  the  bag  as  i  assumed  that  they  were  P.Bimaculatus  juvi's.  I  have  quite  a  few  now.  How  do  i  distinguish  between  P.bimaculatus  and  P.vittatus  ?  The  sub  adult  i  cuaght  near  kanakapura  has  been  id's  by  Nayak  as  P.bimac.  However  the  p.vittatus  i  caught  seem  the  same  just  smaller  ??!!  and  for  the  first  time  i  lost  two  which  jumped  out  !  they  seemed  too  small  to  do  that.   As  ever  the  hobby  proves  that  field  work  is  never  easy,  just  fun  !  Marc,  think  i  need  to  buy  and  keep  the  standard  references  like  i  do  for  birds.  We  have  field  guides  for  birds  (salim  ali,  kazmizec,inkskip   et  al),  herps  (rom  whittaker,  a.banker  ,  who  else  Smile  and  even  arachanids  (CISK  publication).  But  nothing  other  than  the  ranjith  daniels  (which  incidentally  is  excellent,  except  that  that  the  line  illustrations  leave  id  a  chancy  feat)  for  fish  (peninsular  india).my     cherished  axelrod  is  totally  useless  to  me  today.  Pls  let  me  know  what  it  costs  to  acquire  copies  of  petyagoda,  rema  devi,  hora,  menon,day   et  al  so  i  can  plan  for  it.  May  i  also  use  this  opportunity  to  urge  you  in  particular  to  consider  authoring  a  field  guide  with  photos  and  phenotypical  variant  info  for  the  biotopes  you  are  familiar  with.   you  can  rest  assured  that  any  field/publishing  support  that  we  can  provide  will  be  taken  care  of.  
 
 @  jabba  :  As  mentioned  i  have  only  about  6  or  so.  have  discussed  some  better  techniques  of  catchin  them  with  the  ASK  stalwarts.  i  have  one  pending  trip  thsi  week.  goal  is  to  catch  a  few  before  the  rains.   keep  the  setup  ready,  they  are  very  hardy  and  can  tolerate  amazing  variations  in  parameters.  
 
 shiv
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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 3:46 pm Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 I  just  took  a  look  at  your  pics  in  the  gallery.  There  is  one  pic  that  says  "With  a  P.Bimaculatus  juvi  that  was  caught  with  them"...the  fish  other  than  H.  atukorali  in  that  pic  is  P.  vittatus.
 
 It  takes  a  bit  of  experience  to  distinguish  Puntius  in  the  juvenile  stages.   I  use  Day  1878  Fishes  of  India.  It  has  mistakes,  but  is  the  best  as  of  date.  It  also  has  good  plates.  For  basic  identification  you  can  purchase  Talwar  and  Jhingran  1991  or  Jayaram  2010.  
 
 Publishing  an  accurate  field  guide  is  easier  said  than  done  Wink
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valluvar
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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 6:55 pm Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 @marc  thanks.  the  only  easy  id  feature  i  see  is  the  red  tint  in  the  top  1/3  of  the  eye  in  the  case  of   P.bimac  as  opposed  to  p.vitatus.  the  beauty  of  fishing  in  the  chennai-  bangalore  geography  is  how  your  surprise  yourself  on  what  you  caught.  this  has  been  a  good  summer.  now  to  catch  the  monsoon  spawning.my  lone  p.bimac  remains  alone  !  nayaks  id  was  accurate  (as  ever).
 
 the  field  guide  is  not  difficult.  Will  discuss  with  you.  
 
 shiv
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rasikanayak
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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 9:02 pm Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 Puntius  bimaculatus....
 
 Puntius  bimaculatus  is  supposed  to  differ  from  all  other  Indian  Puntius  in  having  7  branched  dorsal  rays  [vs.  8],  a  round  dorsal  spot  at  the  base  of  dorsal  rays  3-7,  and  a  spot  at  base  of  caudal  .  This  description  is  by  Menon  and  Devi  (1992).
 
 
 Puntius  vittatus
 
 
 Regards,
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deepakg
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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 9:24 pm Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 Good  catch  Shiv.   Thumb Up
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Ram_a_rosi
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PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 9:58 am Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

                                                   
Marc  wrote  (View  Post):                
I  just  took  a  look  at  your  pics  in  the  gallery.  There  is  one  pic  that  says  "With  a  P.Bimaculatus  juvi  that  was  caught  with  them"...the  fish  other  than  H.  atukorali  in  that  pic  is  P.  vittatus.
 
 It  takes  a  bit  of  experience  to  distinguish  Puntius  in  the  juvenile  stages.   I  use  Day  1878  Fishes  of  India.  It  has  mistakes,  but  is  the  best  as  of  date.  It  also  has  good  plates.  For  basic  identification  you  can  purchase  Talwar  and  Jhingran  1991  or  Jayaram  2010.  
 
 Publishing  an  accurate  field  guide  is  easier  said  than  done  Wink                

 
 mar  where  can  i  get  to  buy  these  books??
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valluvar
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PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 12:11 pm Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 @  nayak  thanks  for  the  nice  pics.  
 
 @  deepakg  thanks.
 
 
 shiv
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PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 12:41 pm Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 Hi  Ram,
 
 I  think  you  can  purchase  Jayaram  2010  online.  Check  out  this  link  for  example
 
 Day  1978  is  available  online  for  free.  Check  out  www.archive.org  
 
 Talwar  &  Jhingran  may  be  out  of  print.  You  could  try  local  book  vendors  who  may  be  willing  to  source  it  for  you.
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PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 12:45 pm Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 Shiv,
 
 Simple  difference  between  the  two  is,  the  dorsal  fin  spot.  It  is  a  clear  spot  in  P.  bimaculatus  while  it  is  more  of  a  longitudinal  bar  in  the  case  of  P.  vittatus.
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PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 1:03 pm Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 Marc,
 What  about  the  red  tint  in  the  p.bimac  eye  (top  one  third)  ?  Is  it  not  diagnostic  ?  The  dorsal  fin  spot  is  not  tat  clear  in  the  juvi's  .
 
 shiv
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PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 3:08 pm Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 You  mean  to  say  that  the  red  tint  on  the  eye  is  very  clear  in  juvies  ?
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valluvar
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:37 am Post subject: Re: The hunt for Horadandia Atukorali Reply with quote

 No.  The  adult  P.bimaculatus  i  have  as  well  as  the  pictures  i  have  seen  have  clear  red  tint  on  the  top  1/3  of  the  eye.  The  P.Vittatus  that  we  caught  lack  the  tint.  My  question  was  if  the  tint  was  a  positive  id  feature  or  just  a  phenotypical  variant  that   cannot  be  taken  for  granted.  ?  Also  the  P.Bimac  retains  the  lean  shape  as   adults.  The  P.Vittatus  juvis  have  a  body  plan  similar  to  the  bimac's  while  pictures  of  the  adults  seem  to  indicate  that  they  take  on  a  more  P.Conchordius  shape  as  adults.  Sorry  dont  know  the  correct  terms  for  the  shape  i  am  describing.  Complex  puntius  complex  !
 
 shiv
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