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http://indianaquariumhobbyist.com/community/ :: View topic - Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser
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Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser
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rohansd
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 5:30 pm Post subject: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 Hi  All,
 I  got  hold  of  this  regulator  from  Dymax
 
 Its  their  Tower  type  diffuser.  (Dymax  DF  102)
 somehow  am  not  convinced  that  it  works   well.
 
 Very  small  co2  bubble  come  out  of  the  atomiser  (  the  small  white  stone  at  the  bottom  of  Co2  injecttion  tube)  but  they  all  rise  up  and  stick  on  the  very  first  rung  of  the  ladder  and  all  merge  back  to  form  a  big  bubble.
 And  the  bubble  just  keeps  whirling  without  reducing  to  small  size.
 
 Am  i  going  wrong  somewhere  in  using  it  ?
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rgg
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 5:35 pm Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 Rohan,
   No  i  do  not  think  so,  Its  doing  its  job  pretty  well  i  believe.
 
 May  be  you  can  try  out  one  more  thing  for  an  even  better  work  of  reacting,  You  can  knock  off  the  airstone  and  have  a  plastic  bio  ball  in  there  which  is  free  rotating.
 This  would  revolve  with  the  water  current  and  would  also  be  breaking  the  air  bubbles  to  smaller  bubbles  and  you  would  see  even  better  diffusion.
 
 I  have  this  in  2  of  my  tanks  and  this  works  really  well.
 
 Raghu
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nikhilsood1
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 6:00 pm Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 What  you  coulld  also  do   in  addition  to  what  Raghu  told  was,  just  remove  all  the  mixing  chambers  and  put  just  the  airstone  right  at  the  top,  put  a  few  bio  balls  and  then  a  small  piece  of  sponge  which  will  not  let  all  the  bubbles  escape  that  easily.  I  have  done  this  in  my  tank,  difficult  to  take  snaps  as  it  is  behind  a  lot  of  plants,  but  it  seems  to  work  well.
 
 Regards
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rohansd
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 6:16 pm Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 Thanks  Nikhil,
 I  had  a  choice  to  buy  a  diffuser  which  contained  Three  Bio  Balls  instead  of  the  ladder  structure  and  i  chose  to  buy  this  one  Smile
 Hope  it  wasnt  a  wrong  choice  after  all.
 
 @Raghu
 Thanks  .
 Maybe  its  my  perception  that  the  co2  is  not  getting  dissolved  .I  thought  that  becoz  the  bubbles  were  not  breaking  into  smaller  bubbles.
 
 Do  you  also  see  the  behaviour  that  i  described?
 I  mean  large  bubbles  sticking  to  the  rung  of  the  ladder  and  just  whirling  round  and  round  ?
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Madan
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 6:55 pm Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 Rohan  what  you  can  do  is  reassemble  the  reactor.
 
 You'll  notice  that  the  internal  tube  is  surrounded  by  baffle  plates.
 Change  the  position  of  this  with  respect  to  the  water  pipeline.
 It  does  not  matter  actually  as  this  reactor  is  very  efficient,  as  long  you  do  not  see  CO2  bubbles  exiting  with  the  water  don't  bother.
 By  the  way  how  have  you  connected  the  water  inlet  and  outlets?
 For  best  results  water  should  enter  from  top  and  exit  from  the  bottom.  Co2  enters  from  the  diffuser  at  the  bottom  and  moves  up.
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rohansd
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 10:52 am Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 Thanks  Madan.
 I  have  not  tried  tampering  with  the  position  of  the  plates.I  have  connected  the  water  inlet  and  outlet  such  that  water  enters  from  top  and  exits  from  botton.
 But  in  my  case,  the  Co2  enters  from  top  too.I  remember  reading  that  ideally  the  co2  should  rise  against  the  flow  of  water.
 Will  try  them  tonight.
 
 
 BTW,
 I  have  one  more  problem  now.
 I  have  used  a  small  piece  of  transparent  pipe  which  connects  the  output  of  my  internal  filter  to  the  water  inlet  of  this  connector.
 As  soon  as  there  is  power  cut,  the  co2  bubbles  from  diffuser  flow  back  into  the  filter  and  form  an  gas  bubble  there.
 when  the  power  resumes,  the  filter  doesnt  perform  due  to  the  trapped  air  and  produces  large  sound.
 
 Is  this  because  the  connection  between  the  diffuser  and  filter  is  not  airtight  ?
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rgg
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 11:35 am Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 Rohan,
   Yep!!!   As  madan  suggested  your  positioning  of  the  Diffusor  and  the  connectivity  of  inlet  and  outlet  might  be  the  culprit.  
 
    If  you  still  have  the  problem  of  Co2  getting  trapped  inside  the  filter   (  which  should  not  be  the  case  once  the  diffusor  is  placed  in  the  proper  position  )  you  might  wanna  look  at  a  solenoid  if  its  a  pressurised  Co2  setup.
 
 Raghu
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Madan
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 2:49 pm Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 Rohan  
 
 The  solution  is  a  very  simple  one.  Please  make  sure  that  your  pump  is  placed  below  the  reactor.
 
 Connect  up  a  pipe  from  the  pump  to  the  top  of  your  reactor.
 
 This  way  when  the  power  goes  off  the  CO2  will  collect  at  the  highest  point  on  the  top  of  your  reactor  and  your  pump  being  lower  than  the  reactor  will  never  get  gas  locked.
 
 A  few  weeks  ago  I  posted  with  pictures  how  I  modified  this  same  reactor  into  an  external  reactor,  this  is  another  option  you  can  use,  instead  of  cluttering  the  tank.  Check  the  Forum  for  the  post.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 3:25 pm Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 Madan,
   By  doing  this  wont  the  throughput  of  the  filter  fall  down....  
 
 My  Boyu  new  internal  pump  could  not  drive  a  pipe  of  a  feet  high  and  had  to  return  it  back  to  the  LFS  guy  (  it  was  a  700ltr  rated  one  i  believe)  earlier  when  setting  my  new  tank.  Might  be  a  one  special  junk  filter  that  i  had  got.
 
 Raghu
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Madan
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 3:30 pm Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 How  can  the  throughput  reduce  and  by  how  much?
 
 The  Pump  is  in  the  tank,  it  is  under  a  larger  head  of  water  when  kept  under  the  reactor,  so  basically  it  is  not  lifting  the  water  up  and  out  of  the  water  column  at  all.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 3:41 pm Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 Madan,
   Since  we  are  connecting  the  output  of  the  internal  filter  to  the  reactor  and  the  pump  is  at  a  lower  level,  Now  the  pump  has  to  drive  the  water  all  the  way  up  against  the  gravity  till  the  reactor  inlet  isint  it,  Correct  me  if  my  understanding  is  wrong  here.  I  suppose  many  internal  filters  fail  to  do  this.   And  hence  i  believe  the  filter  througput  would  fall  isint  it.  
 
 Eheims  eco  ball  and  others  might  be  exceptions  which  can  drive,  But  my  trails  with  Boyu  in  a  LFS  itslef  failed.
 
 I  did  try  to  save  a  few  paise  here  trying  this  method  to  save  money  to  use  an  internal  filter  since  i  could  not  suceed  i  went  with  the  normal  setup  of  an  Eheim  external  filter.
 
 Raghu
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 3:50 pm Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 I  have  a  powerhead  rated  at  1000l/h  and  it  pushes  water  out  four  feet  higher  than  where  it  is  placed,  via  a  pipe,  and  it  has  no  problems  pushing  water  this  high,  so  I  guess  a  foot  should  not  really  be  an  issue...
 It  is  a  Resun  or  something  power  head...
 (could  the  thickness  of  the  pipe  used  to  push  water  up  make  a  difference...???
   IMO  :   as  the  thicker  the  pipe  more  will  be  the  volume  of  the  water  that  needs  to  be  pushed  up,  and  hence  will  require  a  higher  rated  pump,  we  would  need  with  a  thinner  pipe  to  push  water  to  a  higher  level  using  a  underrated  pump....)
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Madan
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 4:30 pm Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 Your  understanding  is  completely  wrong  Raghu.
 
 Nanu,
 
 The  power  head  develops  a  certain  pressure  by  pumping  a  certain  quantity  of  liquid  -  imparts  energy  to  the  liquid,  if  the  outlet  pipe  dia  is  small  the  same  quantity  of  water  will  move  at  a  higher  velocity,  and  the  smaller  pipe  will  offer  a  bit  of  resistance  to  flow,  however  it  can  be  neglected  in  the  case  of  a  reactor  that  is  being  discussed  here.  A  larger  pipe  will  slow  down  the  velocity  of  flow,  but  the  flow  quantity  will  be  the  same,  a  larger  pipe  will  offer  less  resistance  to  flow.  There  are  various  other  considerations  here,  if  the  pump  delivers  the  fluid  below  the  height  of  the  suction  water  column  the  flow  will  be  greater,  if  the  powerhead  delivers  water  higher  than  the  height  of  the  water  column  on  the  suction  side  the  flow  will  reduce,  but  in  the  case  of  this  reactor,  the  water  is  above  both  the  reactor  and  the  power  head.  The  max  loss  will  only  be  due  to  resistance  in  the  pipeline  -  about  12  inches  length  which  is  again  below  the  head  of  water  -  negligible  loss.
 
 The  whole  thing  is  exactly  similar  to  Electricity  flowing  through  a  wire.  Thicker  the  wire  lower  the  resistance,  remember  school  physics.
 
 Now  consider  connecting  up  a  fluorescent  tube  with  a  single  strand  wire  and  in  a  second  case  with  a  thicker  multistrand  wire  -  how  much  do  you  think  you'll  loose  out  due  to  heat  generated  by  the  resistances  of  the  two  wires?  Negligible  right?  Can  you  feel  the  thinner  single  strand  wire  heating  up?
 
 The  same  happens  here,  you  can  practically  neglect  the  loss.
 
 If  you  still  want  to  be  anal  retentive  about  the  whole  thing,  yes  go  invest  Rs.4000+  on  a  solenoid  valve.
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Nanu
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 5:26 pm Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 Madan  Sir,
 
 I  agree  to  what  you  have  stated:  So,  smaller  diameter  Faster  flow,  larger  diameter  slower  flow,  but  the  total  flow  will  always  be  1000l/h  right..?  
 
 Off  the  topic  but  then  :
 Now  why  does  a  capilary  tube  fills  up  with  water  and  a  thicker  diameter  pipe  doesn't...?
 
 Raghu:
 
                                                 
Quote:                
If  you  still  have  the  problem  of  Co2  getting  trapped  inside  the  filter   (  which  should  not  be  the  case  once  the  diffusor  is  placed  in  the  proper  position  )  you  might  wanna  look  at  a  solenoid  if  its  a  pressurised  Co2  setup.                  

 
 Don't  tell  me  you  are  buying  a  Solenoid  valve  because  your  CO2  is  getting  stuck  in  the  impeller/pump  when  the  lights  are  out..!!!!  Madan  is  right  thats  the  worst  solution  you  can  think  off  ....  or  more  like  the  most  expensive  solution  you  can  think  of  (or  more  expensive  one  would  be  a  Fishtank  dedicated  inverter  ;-)  )
 
 And  I  am  sure  you  are  doing  something  wrong  if  your  700l/h  pumps  cant  pump  out  water  a  foot  higher....
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 5:58 pm Post subject: Re: Help with Dymax DF 102 - Co2 Diffuser Reply with quote

 Nanu,  look  up  surface  tension  of  a  liquid  the  answer  is  somewhere  there.
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