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http://indianaquariumhobbyist.com/community/ :: View topic - Sump System- advice sought
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Sump System- advice sought
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Gulls
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2010 3:30 pm Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

 Thanks  Nirav..
 
 can  you  give  me  the  contact  number  of  Vipul.  Would  be  glad  to  meet  him.
 I  almost  Know  all  the  LFS  guys  (well  almost  all  of  them  know  me  too).  Glass  and  drilling  is  not  the  problem.
 I  have  contacts  for  them.  Even  making  the  aquarium  is  not  an  issue.
 
 The  sump  system  and  the  fool  proof  connectivity  is  a  bit  of  concern.  just  want  to  be  sure  of  the  way  it  has  to  be  and  the  way  it  ought  to  work.
 
 I  lately  came  to  know  of  1  Mr  Shrivastav  who  was  constructing  a  8  foot  marine  tank  with  two  sumps.
 Vipul  VErma's  contact  number  would  be  helpful  (  hope  he  is  friendly  as  you  guys  are).
 is  he  a  member  of  IAH?
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nash81
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2010 4:43 pm Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

 Hi  Srinivas,
 
 No  he  is  not  a  member  of  IAH  but  is  surely  a  friendly  person.  I  will  speak  to  him  if  it  would  be  ok  for  me  to  share  his  contact  details.  If  he  agrees  will  PM  the  same  to  you.
 
 Warm  Regards
 Nirav  Shah
 Indiapetstore.com
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Gulls
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2010 4:55 pm Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:03 pm Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

 hey  GUlls,  
 Here  are  the  pics  I  promised.  Like  nash  said  visit  the  other  hobbyist  who  is  setting  up  the  tank,  I  am  sure  you  will  get  some  good  ideas  when  you  see  it  in  person.
 
 Bulkheads-  white  one  is  barbed  and  the  black  one  is  threaded.
 
 
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:11 pm Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

 Here  is  the  basic  internal  over  flow  for  my  tank  which  is  drilled  in  the  bottom.  The  taller  pvc  with  black  lockline  is  the  return.  See  how  it  skimms  the  water  surface,  it  helps  in  pulling  out  the  dust  and  oils  that  collect  on  the  water  surface  and  takes  it  down  to  the  skimmer  to  be  removed.
 
 
 
 The  short  thicker  pipe  is  the  drain  and  the  thinner  pipe  is  the  return.  
 
 
 
 
 
 See  how  the  teeths  prevents  your  livestock  from  going  into  the  overflow.  Trust  me  the  snails  still  find  a  way  to  get  in  there  and  so  does  some  fishes.  
 
 
 
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:26 pm Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

 here  is  the  bottom  of  the  tank.  The  large  pipe  is  the  drain  and  thinner  one  is  the  return  I  have  only  one  drain  and  return  in  this  tank,  i  barely  get  by  cause  my  pump  fills  my  tanks  almost  faster  then  it  can  drain.  IN  my  main  display  tank  I  have  2  drains  and  1  return.
 
 
 
 Sump.  Left  to  right-  First  compartment  is  where  the  water  drains  and  where  you'll  keep  the  skimmer.  The  water  level  in  this  chamber  is  maintained,  so  It  will  help  you  operate  the  skimmer  better.  You'll  need  stable  water  level  for  you  skimmer  to  work  good.  The  water  level  will  be  maintained  to  the  height  of  the  middle  baffle.  You  will  have  to  determine  that  by  the  type  of  skimmer  you  use.  Most  skimmers  will  work  the  best  at  8-10  inches.  The  first  and  the  third  baffles  are  bubble  traps.  The  first  bafflle  is  raised  1  1/2  inches  from  the  bottom  and  middle  baffle  is  placed  on  the  surface  and  the  third  baffle  is  raised  1  1/2  inches  from  the  bottom.  The  distance  between  the  baffles  is  1  inch.
 
 The  middle  chaber  is  the  return  and  the  third  chanber  is  for  your  fuge.  You  can  make  a  "T"  connection  from  one  of  your  drain  and  have  the  water  go  the  the  fuge  and  it  will  overflow  back  into  your  return  section.  The  flow  thru  your  fuge  should  be  low  and  you  can  controle  it  by  ball  valves.
 
 
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gremlin
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:37 pm Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

 Here  is  the  "T"  connection  from  the  drain  to  take  the  water  to  the  refugium.  I  just  cleaned  the  skimmer  last  evening  and  there  is  only  one  fish  in  this  90g  tank,  but  see  the  amount  of  waste  the  skimmer  pulled  out  in  less  than  12  hrs.
 
 
 
 Return  pump
 
 
 Fuge
 
 
 Always  desing  the  sump  such  that  when  the  power  goes  off  the  water  dont  fill  the  sump  and  flood  the  floor.  
 
 These  are  the  mistakes  I  did  when  setting  up,  letting  you  know  so  you  wont  do  it.
 
 Keep  the  return  spout  just  under  the  water  so  that  it  dont  suck  the  water  back  into  the  sump  during  the  power  outage  and  cause  flood  (been  there  and  done  that)
 
 Design  the  first  chaber  so  that  your  skimmer  will  fit  in  it
 
 MAke  sure  the  baffles  in  the  bubble  trap  are  in  the  right  order  or  you'll  have  major  micro  bubble  problem.  The  water  need  to  go  under  the  first  baffle,  over  the  second  baffle  and  under  the  third  baffle.  iF  this  is  not  in  order  your  return  pump  will  suck  the  bubbles.  I  made  this  mistake  and  now  have  to  add  4th  baffle  to  keep  the  microbubbles  out.
 
 "Always  measure  10  times  and  cut  once"
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Gulls
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2010 10:50 am Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

 WOW..  Crystal  clear  ....
 
 Thanks  for  the  guidance  Gremlin.
 
 Thanks  to  Nirav  too....
 
   Just  one  more  query.  
 
 1)How  do  I  determine  the  rate  of  flow  form  the  drain  pipe  (aquarium  to  sump)?
 2)  Do  Ineed  to   match  the  capacity  of  the  return  pump  ?  As  i  feel  an  overcapacity/undercapacity  pump  cause  flooding  /dry  problems.
 
 
 BTW.Yesterday   I  met  the  guy  who  is  constructing  the  Aquarium  and  sump  for  the  other  hobbyist  mentioned  above.  The  same  guy  who  made  mine...he  he  he   Thumb Up  ..  ..So  now  a  bit  of  help  readily  available..  Nagpur  is  a  very  small  place....  I  told  you....
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gremlin
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2010 11:06 am Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

 my  drains  are  1  inch  and  my  return  is  1/2  inch.  I  think  you  need  a  return  pump  that  is  10  times  the  water  volume.  For  ex  90g  tank  will  need  a  return  pump  of  900g/hr.
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Gulls
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2010 11:23 am Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

 In  that  case,  can  the  pump  return  at  a  rate  more  than  the  drain  could  overflow?
 What  if  the  water  level  in  sump  decreases  at  the  return  chamber?  could  cause  an  equipment  burnout?
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2010 5:13 pm Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

 Dear  Gremlin,  Nirav
 
 Please  check  if  this  model  can  work
 
 
 
 Would  have  the  outflow  from  the  skimmer  at  the  last  chamber  from  where  it  can  be  returned  to  the  tank.
 Planning  this  with  an  overflow  box  form  my  existing  Layout.  Would  leave  scope  for  improvement  for  my  6  footer.
 
 Please  suggest[img]http://indianaquariumhobbyist.com/gallery2/v/User_Galleries/Gulls/My+sump+design.bmp.html[/img]
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2010 6:45 pm Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

                                                   
Quote:                
In  that  case,  can  the  pump  return  at  a  rate  more  than  the  drain  could  overflow?  
 What  if  the  water  level  in  sump  decreases  at  the  return  chamber?  could  cause  an  equipment  burnout                

 
 ofcourse  your  return  pump  will  burn  out  if  the  water  level  gets  low  and  pump  runs  dry.  But  you  can  sorta  determine  the  evopration  rate  for  your  tank  and  add  water  accordingly.  But  when  the  water  level  gets  really  low  you'll  have  microbubbles  all  over  your  tank,  you  shouldnt  let  it  get  to  that  point.  in  my  250g  i  add  5g  each  day  to  replace  the  evoprated  water.  This  is  also  inportant  to  maintain  your  salinaty.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2010 6:57 pm Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

                                                   
Quote:                
Would  have  the  outflow  from  the  skimmer  at  the  last  chamber  from  where  it  can  be  returned  to  the  tank.                

 
 IF  you  do  this,  you'll  have  lot  of  microbubbles,  the  water  out  of  the  skimmer  is  full  of  microbubbles,  unless  you  have  one  that  wont  produce  microbubbles,  all  the  skimmers  I  have  seen  produce  tonnes  of  them.  Also  you  have  used  only  one  glass  partition  (baffles),  i  recommend  using  atleast  3.  also  get  rid  of  the  bio  balls,  its  no  use  other  than  nitrate  factory.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:27 pm Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

 Voila...
 
 No  bio  bals  required....
 Then  only  the  skimmer  would  be  in  the  sump!!!!!!!!
 
 I  have  a  weipro  SA2014  protein  skimmer.  It  stands  tall  as  Eifel  tower  and  yesterday  I  checked  the  height  of  the  cabinet.  It  wont  fit  in  there   Sad  
 
 Now  I  will  have  to  keep  the  filter  hanging  Sad  
 
 At  least  ,  Now  I  know  when  I  prepare  for  my  large  tank.  Entire  dimensions  and  new  equipments  have  to  be  worked  out..
 
 BTW  I  removed  my  canister  filter  form  the  aquarium  post  your  suggestion.  Hope  my  tank  would  sustain  the  filteration  with  Live  rocks  and  this  protein  skimmer.
 Yesterday  took  some  pics  of  my  tank.  Would  post  it  soon....
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2010 4:39 pm Post subject: Re: Sump System- advice sought Reply with quote

 Hi  Srinivas
 
 The  design  will  be  fine,  I  usually  prefer  20X  water  flow  in  my  tanks,  which  is  why  if  i  have  a  300G  tank,  i  use  a  pump  600G  pump,  1"  Drill  should  drain  estimated  800G/hr.
 
 Well  i  would  suggest  you  get  alll  your  equipment  first  and  then  get  the  tank  built.  So  that  you  exactly  have  things  in  order  as  to  which  equipment  is  going  where  and  such  things  dont  happen.
 
 Since  you  mention  frequent  power  failures,  I  would  not  suggest  an  overflow  box.  Since  there  are  times  the  siphon  might  break  in  it  and  you  may  wake  up  to  a  flooded  room.  I  would  still  suggest  you  get  your  existing  tank  drilled  and  then  go  for  the  sump.
 
 Warm  Regards
 Nirav  Shah
 Indiapetstore.com
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