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http://indianaquariumhobbyist.com/community/ :: View topic - micro tubefex species from Delhi. Culturing method.
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micro tubefex species from Delhi. Culturing method.
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deepakg
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 11:12 pm Post subject: Re: Mini Tubifex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

 So  let  it  be  Romifex...  what  say  gentlemen..  Very Happy  
 
 Please  vote  or  I'll  consider  changing  the  topic  name  myself..  Thumbs Up
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Romi
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 1:17 am Post subject: Re: Mini Tubifex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

                                                   
deepakg  wrote  (View  Post):                
So  let  it  be  Romifex...  what  say  gentlemen..  Very Happy  
 
 Please  vote  or  I'll  consider  changing  the  topic  name  myself..  Thumbs Up                

 
 ha  ha
 
 BTW,  do  u  know  Surya-niki?  Another  avid  live  food  enthusiast  who  has  done  his  bit,  and  very  graciously  too,  to  help  fellow  hobbyists  grow  their  own...
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deepakg
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 1:48 pm Post subject: Re: Mini Tubifex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

                                                   
Romi  wrote  (View  Post):                
                                                 
deepakg  wrote  (View  Post):                
So  let  it  be  Romifex...  what  say  gentlemen..  Very Happy  
 
 Please  vote  or  I'll  consider  changing  the  topic  name  myself..  Thumbs Up                

 
 ha  ha
 
 BTW,  do  u  know  Surya-niki?  Another  avid  live  food  enthusiast  who  has  done  his  bit,  and  very  graciously  too,  to  help  fellow  hobbyists  grow  their  own...                

 Yes  I  do  know  Surya_niki.  He  is  a  pro  hobbyist.  Very Happy  
 in  fact  I  got  the  whiteworms  from  him  only.
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rasikanayak
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 9:15 pm Post subject: Re: Romifex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

 Romi  and  Deepak,
 
 I  will  be  the  most  happiest  if  these  worms  are  named  after  Romi  scientifically.  But  that  will  entail  more  efforts  than  we  have  put  in  now.  None  of  us  are  trained  Biologists.  So  better  to  send  these  worms  to  a  certified  biologist  and  get  their  opinion  before  we  name  the  worms.
 
 Secondly,  without  knowing  the  exact  species  of  these  worms  calling  them  indigenous  to  India  will  be  a  bit  futile.  While  standing  firmly  for  enthusiasm  among  members,  IAH  has  also  a  responsibility  towards  facts.
 
 Deepakg,  Kindly  change  the  title  of  this  post  till  the  species  is  identified  definitely  or  else  it  will  appear  a  farce.  
 
 Romi,  This  is  in  any  way  without  belittling  your  efforts  in  sending  your  culture  to  South  India  and  your  contribution  in  spreading  the  knowledge  about  live  feed.
 
 Regards,
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deepakg
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 9:30 pm Post subject: Re: Romifex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

                                                   
rasikanayak  wrote  (View  Post):                
Romi  and  Deepak,
 
 I  will  be  the  most  happiest  if  these  worms  are  named  after  Romi  scientifically.  But  that  will  entail  more  efforts  than  we  have  put  in  now.  None  of  us  are  trained  Biologists.  So  better  to  send  these  worms  to  a  certified  biologist  and  get  their  opinion  before  we  name  the  worms.
 
 Secondly,  without  knowing  the  exact  species  of  these  worms  calling  them  indigenous  to  India  will  be  a  bit  futile.  While  standing  firmly  for  enthusiasm  among  members,  IAH  has  also  a  responsibility  towards  facts.
 
 Deepakg,  Kindly  change  the  title  of  this  post  till  the  species  is  identified  definitely  or  else  it  will  appear  a  farce.  
 
 Romi,  This  is  in  any  way  without  belittling  your  efforts  in  sending  your  culture  to  South  India  and  your  contribution  in  spreading  the  knowledge  about  live  feed.
 
 Regards,                

 ok...  sounds  good.  That  way  we  will  come  to  know  more  about  them.
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Romi
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 10:50 pm Post subject: Re: Romifex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

 @rasik
 
 Rasikj,  I  have  a  very  good  idea  of  your  point,  for  sure.  I  can  see  very  clearly  how  absurd  it  might  be  if  hobbyists  found  a  species  in  nature  and,  because  of  their  interest  in  it  as  something  useful  to  the  hobby,  gave  it  a  grand  label  and  promoted  it  blindly  among  themselves.  All  without  the  benefit  of  a  scientific  investigation  of  their  find.  Very Happy  We  are  like  kids  in  our  enthusiasm,  men  become  boys,  the  hobby  foments  passion  that  blurs  the  vision  and  even  undermines  plain  common  sense!   When  I  write  a  message  and  see  it  literally  peppered  with  smilies,  I  ask  myself  how  can  something  like  this  be  such  fun,  learning,  and  sharing,  finding  and  taking,  so  many  years  into  adulthood….  isn't  it  kiddish?  But  hey!  I  see  it  in  so  many  others  too,  so  i  assume  all's  well   Very Happy   
 
 So  I  know  what  you  mean  there.  But  I  would  also  urge  you  to  note  that  the  word  I  used  was  “indigenous”  and  not  “endemic.”  There  is  a  world  of  a  difference,  as  I  am  sure  you  will  concede,  if  you  think  it  over.  Indigenous  only  means  that  whatever  the  habitat  of  a  species  might  be,  one  country  or  two  dozen,  the  area  in  which  it  as  found  also  represents  PART  of  its  nativity.  So  even  if  this  small  tubifex  is  found  in  Western  India,  coastal  Burma,  upper  Bangladesh,  or  border  of  Bhutan,  it  is  still  as  much  a  native  here  in  Delhi  as  it  is  there.  I  am  sure  you  will  agree  it  is  not  less  native  here  then  there,  if  that  is  so.  So  our  claim  it  is  a  Delhi  native  is  genuine.  i  found  it  3  times,  and  on  Aquapetz.com,  Asheesh  found  it  and  i  IDed  it  for  him,  since  i  now  recognise  it  anywhere,  after  all  this  time..
 
 If  if  I  had  instead  used  the  word  “endemic”,  I  would  indeed  have  been  claiming  to  know  more  about  them  than  I  actually  do.  Because  endemic  is  not  only  native  to  an  area  but  RESTRICTED  to  it,  not  found  elsewhere,  period.  Since  I  have  no  way  of  knowing  that,  I  did  not  use  the  word  here  at  all.  
 
 I  would  suggest  all  readers  of  this  thread  also  read  this  for  information  on  these  two  important  terms:
 
 http://in.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20110715032230AAjmCG6
 
 I  am  always  most  careful  to  admit  my  assumptions,  especially  if  they  prove  wrong,  as  a  layperson.  If  you  read  my  detailed  comment  about  the  2011  thread  that  Ishaan   found,  I  admit  that  the  worms  similar  to  Grindal  Worms  (Enchytraeus  buchholzi)  in  size  and  to  White  Worms  (Enchytraeus  albidus)  in  love  for  cool  tempertures,  were  none  of  the  two  species  but  a  third  one.  And  the  third  one  was  not  so  useful  as  either  of  them.  So  I  gave  up  on  them  and  just  use  the  usual  Grindal  worms  that  Suryaniki  sent  to  Delhi.  
 
 BTW  Grindal  worms  were  only  found  by  a  hobbyist  like  us.  Mrs  Grindal  of  Scandinavia  loved  her  fish,  and  seperated  it  from  from  White  Worms.  It  did  not  die  in  the  heat  like  the  White  Worms.  It  was  useful  for  just  this  one  reason.  It  was  decades  later  that  it  was  IDed...  
 
 I  am  glad  you  have  given  the  subject  enough  thought  to  have  made  a  point  regarding  it,  and  I  can  see  your  have  helped  Deepak  and  me  a  great  deal  in  introducing  this  species  to  hobbyist  south  of  the  Vindhyas,  the  photos  were  excellent,  I  mailed  you  mine,  and  u  can  see  they  were  nothing  next  to  yours..  I  appreciate  that  no  end.  
 
 Can  I  take  this  opportunity  to  also  seek  your  help  in  finding  a  biologist  on  IAH  who  might  be  able  to  help  us  ID  this  species  for  us?  That  would  be  great.  A  similar  effort  was  made  for  ID  of  Java  Moss  on  www.aquamoss.net  (I  was  reading  the  threads  myself  as  they  were  made).  And  that  website  became  THE  site  for  moss  lovers  as  soon  as  Dr  Tan  helped  hobbyist  IDed  the  moss  as  Taxiphyllum  barbieri  instead  of  Vesicularia  daubenyana.  After  this,  even  websites  in  the  US  and  UK  corrected  themselves  and  use  the  correct  name  since.  So  hobbyist  often  set  off  the  chain  that  ultimately  leads  to  correct  IDs.  Till  then  we  NEED  to  name  it,  and  the  name  naturally  cannot  be  Latin!  
 
 Let  me  cite  another  example.  The  Pleco  catfish  range  has  many  species  that  were  unknown  to  scientists  for  a  long  time  even  though  they  had  been  kept  and  bred  by  hobbyists  for  ages!  Evcn  today,  many  plecos  have  no  latin  names,  they  are  catalouged  by  L-number,  all  the  doing  of  hobbyists,  no  professionals.   PFK  regularly  writes  about  species  discovered  not  by  biologists  but  by  fish  hobbyist-plus-exporters,  some  right  here  in  India.  I  think  this  is  because  we  hobbyists  have  a  ton  of  enthusiasm,  and  even  the  botanists/biologists/ichthyologists  catch  it  from  us.  
 
 When  I  found  these  I  waited  a  long  time  to  mention  it,  and  thread  I  made,   now  it  turns  out,  was  actually  no  thread  of  mine  but  GokulMC’s,  and  that  was  just  last  year.  So  I  kept  these  for  3-odd  years,  can't  remember  too  well,  end  of  2009,  all  2010,  all  2011,  till  I  was  sure  about  their  usefulness,  had  tried  a  variety  of  ways  of  keeping  them,  finalised  one,  then  I  decided  to  share.  And  I  checked  far  and  wide  on  the  internet,  and  found  no  known  tubifex   species  loved  the  food  and  living  conditions  that  i  found  they  preferred.  The  Duro/Microfex  worm  connection  I  freely  admitted  and  put  on  record,  finally  deciding  they  needed  too  different  a  set  of  conditions  from  them  to  be  the  same.   
 
 I  hope  you  see  my  point  too,  excuse  me  for  how  long  I  took  to  make  it!  Very Happy


Last edited by Romi on Wed Sep 12, 2012 11:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Romi
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 11:00 pm Post subject: Re: micro tubefex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

 I  must  also  admit  one  more  thing.  I  was  planning  to  send  a  culture  to  fellow  live  food  enthusiast  Gokul  from  Erode,  but  he  and  i  were  exchanging  some  stuff,  and  the  plan  kept  getting  indefinitely  postponed.  But  then  Deepak,  who  also  knew  about  them  for  i  think  for  a  year  and  a  half,  suddenly  took  the  initiative.  He  sent  Mealworms  to  Delhi,  driving  a  long  distance  to  VyasTK  to  get  them  for  me,  and  i  felt  honour-bound  to  reciprocate  ASAP!   That's  how  this  thread  was  made.
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deepakg
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:14 am Post subject: Re: micro tubefex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

 Nayakjee...
 have  we  checked  them  yet  by  a  biologist?
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rasikanayak
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 9:12 am Post subject: Re: micro tubefex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

                                                   
deepakg  wrote  (View  Post):                
Nayakjee...
 have  we  checked  them  yet  by  a  biologist?                

 Deepak,  Not  yet.
 
 Here  are  a  few  more  pics  of  Romifex....
 
 From  the  archives  of  Romi...
 
 
 Worms  in  my  new  culture....
 
 
 Harvesting  the  worms....
 
 
 Regards,
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Ashwin
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 10:32 am Post subject: Re: micro tubefex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

 Just  a  thought,  it  is  long  thread  and  for  people  who  have  not  been  following  the  thread,  it  could  be  difficult  to  comprehend  the  technique  of  culturing  the  worms.
 
 I  would  like  to  suggest  that  the  seniors/experts  who  have  now  been  culturing  the  worms  for  a  while  make  a  complication  of  the  techniques  of  culture  along  with  suitable  photos  and  post  it  on  the  thread.
 
 Just  a  suggestion
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Romi
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 1:51 pm Post subject: Re: micro tubefex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

                                                   
Ashwin  wrote  (View  Post):                
Just  a  thought,  it  is  long  thread  and  for  people  who  have  not  been  following  the  thread,  it  could  be  difficult  to  comprehend  the  technique  of  culturing  the  worms.
 
 I  would  like  to  suggest  that  the  seniors/experts  who  have  now  been  culturing  the  worms  for  a  while  make  a  complication  of  the  techniques  of  culture  along  with  suitable  photos  and  post  it  on  the  thread.
 
 Just  a  suggestion                

 
 Ashwin,  there  is  only  so  much  some  one  can  do  when  he  is  finding/sending/distributing  you  stuff  FREE.  If  reading  a  thread  is  too  much  effort  for  a  hobbyist  who  wants  live  food,  food  that  will  allow  him  to  basically  convert  oatmeal  into  top  class  fishfood,  then  that  hobbyist  is  not  a  'live  food'  hobbyist.  He  is  best  left  to  keep  fishes  that  eat  stuff  out  of  platic  jars  and  sachets.  
 
 Of  all  the  people  i  have  given  cultures  in  Delhi,  no  one  expecting  everything  on  a  platter  EVER  succeeds  in  keeping  live  food  in  the  end.  i  keep  this  food  because  when  i  see  my  Badis  badis  showing  amazing  good  health  even  though  they  starve  otherwise,  I  have  enough  motivation  to  find  food  they  will  eat.  These  worms  are  for  those  kind  of  people.   
 
 No  offence!
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syed
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 3:19 pm Post subject: Re: micro tubefex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

 I  have  being  trying  my  hand  on  these  worms  for  over  and  year,  but  every  time  they  died  out  due  to  some  issue,  either  i  over  feed  them  or  water  got  spoiled.  Finally  now  i  have  them  going.  I  have  being  feeding  them  to  Betta  Adult  and  Frys,  Apistos  Fry,  CPDs,  they  all  love  it.
 
 Keeping  them  now  is  simple  for  me,  this  is  what  i  am  following
 1.  Well  ventilated  area,  when  i  kept  them  in  room,  they  never  got  going
 2.  daily  Water  change
 3.  Diet,  oatmeal  flour  and  normal  atta  mixed,  this  was  suggested  by  another  champion  Vijendra
 4.  then  on  off  i  also  drop  some  tetrabit  flakes,  very  smal  quantity,  i  have  noticed  that  the  alternate  day  i  get  max  harvest  of  worm,  but  if  i  give  regularly  then  that  doesnt  happen  Sad,  so  not  getting  greedy
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Romi
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 9:42 am Post subject: Re: micro tubefex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

 @syed
 
 Tetrabits  do  get  them  off  to  a  flying  start,  yes.  But  since  that  is  an  excellent  dry  food  in  itself,  i  would  suggest  it  be  used  only  as  a  last  resort!
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Ashwin
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 11:09 am Post subject: Re: micro tubefex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

 No  offence  taken.  .  .  .
 
 I  have  been  following  the  thread  for  a  long  time  and  having  been  watching  you,  Deepak  and  Mr.  Nayak  putting  a  lot  of  effort  to  explain  to  lot  of  hobbyists  how  to  culture  it  as  well  trying  to  fine  tune  the  culture  technique.  .  .   good  effort
 
 Would  you  not  liked  to  be  credited  for  this  effort??  
 
 If  not,  say  i  tomorrow  i  take  the  details  of  the  culture  and  then  culture  it,  takes  some  photos  and  explain  in  brief  the  methodology  of  culture  and  claim  that  i  have  developed  it  in  a  new  thread  or  in  some  other  forum  .  .  .   are  you  ok???  if  so  then  ok
 
 One  more  aspect,  you  have  started  the  thread  and  would  love  to  go  on  forever.  .  .   but  it  will  die  down.  A  couple   of  year  later  someone  wants  to  start  a  culture  it,  but  he  will  not  go  through  a  thread  with  10  -  20  pages,  where  he  not  even  sure  that  it  will  give  him  some  info.
 
 Think  like  someone  new  who  wants  to  culture.  .  .   This  is  er  a  when  people  want  it  short,  sweet  and  precise  
 
 The  methodology  is  not  a  10  page  write  up.  .  .  it  is  just  a  few  lines  with  photos  to  support,  Mr.  Nayak  would  do  it  in  a  day  but  probably  is  waiting  for  you  to  do  the  honors
 
 i  am  mediocre  person  in  this  field,  so  would  would  not  have  the  patience  to  go  through  all  that  trouble  as  you  suggested
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random2
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 11:42 am Post subject: Re: micro tubefex species from Delhi. Culturing method. Reply with quote

 Ashwin,
 
 The  fact  is  that  this  is  still  an  experiment  in  progress.  Actually  we  dont  even  know  what  kind  of  worms  these  are.
 
 1.  Suggestion  in  your  first  post  in  the  thread  -
 It  will  take  some  more  time.  Though  the  thread  is  8  pages  long,  its  just  around  20  days  old.  People  are  still  trying  out  methods  to  keep  them  in  an  optimal  way.
 
 2.  If  you  want  to  keep  them,  you  can  get  in  touch  with  the  members  who  have  them  and  follow  Romi's  SOP.  He  has  been  keeping  them  for  2+  years  so  that  method  works.
 
 These  things  need  quite  a  bit  of  patience  and  cant  happen  quickly.  Think  you  know  better  than  me  in  that  aspect  Smile
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